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police / legal | youth

Is there ever a time when calling the cops is ok?

Torn between not liking cops and (maybe) needing them.
Is there ever a time when calling the cops is ok? See, I have not had very good experiences with the cops before, but one of my kids got jumped by 6 others and beat up a little- black eye, contusions. We don't have med. insurance, so I wondered if making a report might be a good idea for future reference. At least to have a record of the assault. I don't know if it might make a difference, just need a little input as to when (if) to ever call the police.
good question 10.Nov.2005 20:36

liberated?

You know that is a really good question. My experience is this: If you call the cops because you need some help, make sure first that there is no one else to help you with the problem BECAUSE:
If you have not broken the law you have still involved yourself "with the Law" and there will still be subtle changes, say intrusions, into your life.
The police are curious about everybody, who is right and who is wrong is not really their format. They see everyone at a scene as "involved" and they go from there. Modern psychologists that they are they are also very creative and imaginative and will assume that you are probably not all that innocent, no matter what.
Ugh.

can be a good idea 10.Nov.2005 20:51

don't be holding

Calling a cop is better than taking the law in your own hands.

With the advent of the war on drugs many people have taken to gangs and vendetta
as a logical results of no civil access to justice.

Oregon Congess lady lost her job for being a victim.

keep them busy doing useful work 10.Nov.2005 20:58

copwatcher

I say: keep them busy doing something useful, like responding to dangerous motorists or taking reports on assaults. They'll have less time for things like harassing homeless people or targeting minorities.

In a cop-free society, you would have the option of vigilante justice, but in today's society that could just get you in more trouble than the original assailant. At any rate, don't let people get away with things that are without question wrong, like assault. They'll feel emboldened to hurt somebody else by your inaction.

Report it 10.Nov.2005 21:42

Phil

Cops are not there specifically to pick on homeless people, beat protestors, and shoot people on fire. The idea behind the police is that they help you in your time of need by solving a crime for you. This may not work in practice but you should at least give them a chance!
The police are not inherently bad, it is just some officers who give the force a bad name. Call em up and report it. Let us know how it goes.

There shouldn't be police 10.Nov.2005 21:50

A

But until they're gone, they have a monopoly on certain things, so calling the cops can be necessary, but only in very rare circumstances.

prepay legal 10.Nov.2005 22:03

memyselfandi

Just mak sure you call your lawer for advice and Or tell the police when they arive you are prepaid legal, and wish to find out exactly what laws should be inforced.

Domestic Violence 10.Nov.2005 22:18

DJ Shadow

The only time I ever called the cops was for a domestic violence situation. I was worried the woman was going to get seriously hurt. I didn't feel like I had the skills to safely intervene, and there was no other resource that I was aware of. I have heard that dealing with domestic violence is one place where cops actually get some good de-escalation training, and where there are more services available to support victims. I think if there is no other way to help keep people safe, calling the cops might make sense.

thanks, folks, but... 10.Nov.2005 22:19

concerned

A couple of things: first, the people involved in this assault are 12-14 years old, so I don't think that I'm getting vigilanty on them. Secondly, cops DO pick on the homeless, shoot and beat my comrade protestors -cops also defend business over human and non-human kind and are racist, classist, and sexist in nature. They are bad. They propogate and protect the system. Hence, my quandry. Anyway, thanks for the input.

One more thing 10.Nov.2005 22:21

concerned

I don't even have a dentist, let alone a lawyer.

Curious 10.Nov.2005 22:38

as to

What you would like to happen?

End the other kids bullying your kid? Punish them somehow? Put them in jail?

The thing about the police is that their really not creative. Its jail or no jail. Fine or no fine. Thats what your looking at with the cops.

The only thing that i use the police for are violent situations in the moment. When i know that violence is going down, and i don't feel the capability to deal with it, thats when i sometimes call the police. Also, when im looking to pursue legal action against someone. If i get hit by a car on my bike and they drive away, I'll call the cops because its what is going to get me the most damages out of a fucked up situation.

But it doesn't sound like your interested in suing these kids or anything ridiculous like that. So the question is, what do you feel like you need to do to safeguard the children you care about? cops aren't going to be there guarding your kids against bullies. So you need another option.

I used to trust the police, but now I don't know. 10.Nov.2005 23:28

Fred Bauer

Solzhenitsyn once said, "When you are attacked by a dog, you don't call a wolf."

oh, I forgot to mention 11.Nov.2005 01:40

copwatcher

Equip your children to protect themselves. I'm sure if you looked hard enough you could find someone who would teach them martial arts (defense-oriented, such as judo) for free. You do have money enough to buy pepper spray, right? I mean, a small cannister is about seven bucks. Can you identify the bullies to talk with their parents? If those kids damage your kid, the parents of the bullies could be liable, and I'm sure they don't want that.

My position on cops 11.Nov.2005 14:10

bEn

In a capitalist society, cops are needed to protect it. Capitalism creates classes, which creates crime. The poor cannot survive on what they are given, so in order to survive, they must break the law. Robberies, drug selling, anything where money is gained, is where you will find the most crimes. Obviously, someone will be affected negatively through a crime. In that situation, you need police, however much I hate to say it. Capitalism forces us to have an authoritarian system. So, yes cops are needed. Because we live in a country driven by money, there is no way to peacefully live without police. What would be EXTREMELY helpful is if they had some sort of check to get in the police force. Some sort of test. I have had MANY encounters with police, and the majority of them are, well, dumb. Getting a job as a soldier or a police officer is extremely easy. And in a society where most of the people do not like policeman, you are going to get the largest nut jobs to take the jobs. Who are the people who enjoy the American system the most, who wave their 15 foot flags outside their houses? The nut jobs. People like neo-Nazis, bigots, people who have generally been traumatized by one specific "type" of people, people who believe more in the system then their own basic morals. With that, you have pregadous. And with pregadous, people in charge will not do their job. People who are generally dumb, who voted for bush, will take their anger out on peaceful protestors. People who have been raised their whole life to hate black people will obviously take their anger out on black people. You won't find a lot of all together good people on that force, because if they were really good people, they would notice the flaw in the system and never take the job in the first place. But I digress; there are some good cops out there. But, even though they are good they still have to follow standards and rules where their actions would be unmoral. Cops are trained to believe that all drugs are bad, and believe that anything they do to drug users or dealers is justified because they are an abuser of the substance. When given that much power, and that much control over the situation, you really have to be smart. And look what happens when we put a really dumb person into the highest position of power (Bush). So, until we remove ourselves from capitalism we will need police to uphold the law. Does that mean that it is a good thing, no. But we will still need them.

So this is my suggestion for you concerned, try to take care of the situation while using the most peaceful and effective methods. Once you find yourself helpless, call the police. But, don't just call the police, connect with the investigation. If you really believe that your child is at risk for another attack I really do suggest acting upon this. When you call the police, find out the police's position on all of it. Find out what methods they will use to end this. If you see a flaw in their methods, point it out to them. Always be on the same page they are, and you will probably wind up being successful. People's anger leads to causing even a larger problem. War causes future wars, and violence causes future violence. Just be careful, and really take this matter seriously.

Fight fire with fire 11.Nov.2005 16:24

anon

Personally, I'd get some bigger, slightly older kids to teach those bullies what it's all about. Sorry, I know that's not a peaceful or constructive way to deal with it, but it's effective. Back in the day, I would have had a talk with the other kids' parents, but in my experience, these kids are bullies cuz their parents are too. And as an adult, you don't dare approach those little bastards or the law'll surely be on you!

you could have your kid walk home with five friends 11.Nov.2005 18:11

there are many possible solutions

> I'm sure if you looked hard enough you could find someone who would
> teach them martial arts (defense-oriented, such as judo) for free.

First of all, contrary to American folklore judo is a kind of formalized wrestling. It's a sport. You don't train to disarm people who have knives or to defeat six attackers at once. Frankly, even talented martial artists who train a lot would have trouble dealing with six attackers except by running away (a technique anybody can learn, I highly recommend it).

If anybody here does go shopping for martial arts training, I would suggest leaving your politics at the door. There's no meaningful difference between "defense" and "offense" if you're getting jumped by a mob. The one M.A. that promotes itself as "nonviolent," aikido, is powerful but among the more difficult to learn.

Different people will have talents in different styles. I remember when I was young I was a strong judoka, but I wasn't fast enough to study karate successfully. My teachers would call out "faster, faster!" but the pedal was already to the metal, so to speak.