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Free And Independent Cascadia Planning Meeting

For a long time people have talked about Cascadia rising up and seceeding from the union. Some say we should ask Canada to take us in, other aspire to a life free from governance by someone outside the community. It's time to get together and talk about it in tangible terms (time-frame etc.)
Around 51% of the country that was allowed to vote said that Bush represented them.
Around 98% of the country said that a war-mongering tyrant represented them.

Cascadia is different. Cascadia has never supported this bullshit. Bush I called Portland Little Beirut. It's time we take back the land that is rightfully ours. I've got some ideas on how it could happen, but I'm sure you do too and that a compromise can be reached. After all, most of you on this board have stood with me in the streets while riot cops sprayed us down. A minor detail like the methodology of our achievment of freedom shouldn't stop it from happening. Freedom is the only thing really important right now.

Not to worry, this won't be some bullshit PPRC meeting. We will have no leader, just probobally a facilitator and someone to take stack.

The proposed time, day and place is Saturday, November 13th at 5:30PM. We will meet at Pioneer Courhouse Square, but don't worry, we have nearby locations, but we want to determine which one to use based on the amount of people who show up. Spread the word!

There's obviously a buzz about this:
>  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302556.shtml
>  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302602.shtml
>  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302547.shtml
>  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302524.shtml

Questions?  Regicidaltendancies@riseup.net

~Some Kid

PS: I can't really answer questions about how cascadia will be, that's more the purpose of this meeting. I could say how I envision cascadia to be, but not what some official rule would be.
Do some up front preparation 08.Nov.2004 10:12

The Secretary

If you want to make this a useful and effective meeting then do some planning before the meeting. If you don't do anything ahead of time you may have some fun, but risk the project stall and die.

Please take this seriously and don't waste people's time and effort or you will quickly loose the people you will need to see it through.

Some ideas I have: An interested lawyer or law student. An agenda spelled out in advance (you can deviate, but it helps to create or return to the focus). A really good facilitator who has commitment and knows how to see a complex project through.

Other comments?

Cascadia ... meaning? 08.Nov.2004 10:35

lc

i've got a few important questions (and obstacles) for you all to consider:

What are the approximate boundaries of this proposed Cascadia?

What do you plan on doing with the many folks who support Bush, Gordon Smith, and the republicans in the Oregon state legislature? These people live within the boundaries of any proposed Cascadia that i can think of.

Hell, what do you plan to do with those folks who think that Kerry ran a great campaign -- and Ron Wyden is a terrific representative of the people?

republic of cascadia 08.Nov.2004 10:48

research

have you seen this website?

 http://zapatopi.net/cascadia.html

Cascadia site 08.Nov.2004 11:25

anarKezbian

That was an interesting site. I especially love the Starbucks Houseblend postage stamp! come on people...grow your minds!

yeah 08.Nov.2004 11:33

some kid

i've considered these things. I have two visions of how this could happen of my own, and plan to voice them, but I can't plan it all myself lest the community not feel involved and either resist the resistance or accept it and we go back to what we have.

On that subject, that site annoys me quite a lot. They have the rules and regulations of cascadia all set out. That's nonsense. If we want a state where the people have little, if any, involvement in the govening process, we've already got amerika. Let's do this differently.

I'm going to call Stu Sugarman from the National Lawyers Guild today to see if he can show up. If anyone else can come up with someone with legal information pertinant to the subject at hand, please bring them. Please bring anyone you can for that matter.

As for those completely and totally satisfied with Kerry as a representative. I really genuinely believe those people to be extremely scarce if not nonexistant. The "we love kerry" sentiment was around mostly to get other people on board so things can be not quite as bad. Who's going to join your team if you hate it, as one person told me.

keep us informed 08.Nov.2004 11:39

cynic carpe_viam@hotmail.com

Hope someone will set up a place where you will post results of the meeting and subsequent feedback for those of us too distant to attend.

Here's One Suggested Plan By The Way 08.Nov.2004 11:47

some kid

someone I know has been touting the idea of resisting Martin Luther style. We get together and determine what we don't like about Amerika and arrange them by category onto prettily colored sheets of paper and plaster them all over cascadia. As time progresses, say we have our sheet of what we don't like about the police. Once these flyers have attracted enough people to see our side of things, we end our "what's wrong with police" flyer with "Therefore, the police are hereby given 2 months to leave" if they do, and they won't, fantastic, but if they don't, nonviolent direct action takes place. Should we use indymedia to pool ideas of what we don't like about amerika? Somebody should post a board for that. Any critiques of this method? Here's a set of flyers by the way. Let's get the word out to everyone around.

Random addtions 08.Nov.2004 12:26

The Secretary

1 Do this indoors. It is going to get cold and rainy outside.

2 Plan on unwanted observers and/or undercover agents.

3 Maybe?? take photos of all involved so as to identify those from item 2 later.

4 Plan on intentional interferance from item 2.

5 Start a blog somewhere to keep all the minutes of the procedings available.

6 Stay legal. This could be considered sedition if you are not careful.

7 Keep it all as "respectable" as possible. You are going to want to get the UN, Canada, or other nations to ally with this project eventually.

Cascadian Flag 08.Nov.2004 14:00

Comrade Lake

Since everyone seems to be making one....
Proposed flag for the Cascadian Workers Syndicate
Proposed flag for the Cascadian Workers Syndicate

Is discussing secession legal? 08.Nov.2004 14:25

not a lawyer

In the reading I've done on the subject, discussing secession is entirely legal in the US. Advocating the violent overthrow of the US gov is illegal, but secession leaves the US gov intact (it just separates us from its authority.) But I wonder if any lawyers out there could keep us informed on this issue. I'm not a lawyer and can't speak with surety on this.

Not that I think doing some illegal things is necessarily bad. But the public face of the Cascadia movement should stay on the legal side if possible, at least during these early phases of spreading the idea, developing an organization, etc.

I strongly favor the Ghandi approach, non-violent resistence to bring about social change. But it is important to remember that even Ghandi's movement was pushed along by it violent counterpart. Every major transition in government that I can think of has had some violence associated with it.

Just for a taste: I've recently re-read Thoreau's "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience", which is full of awesome wisdom for this difficult time. The style's a little old-fashioned, but the ideas are as true today as ever. Here's a sample paragraph. Read the whole essay at the URL below.

"Under a government which imprisons unjustly, the true place for a just man is also a prison. The proper place today, the only place which Massachusetts has provided for her freer and less despondent spirits, is in her prisons, to be put out and locked out of the State by her own act, as they have already put themselves out by their principles. It is there that the fugitive slave, and the Mexican prisoner on parole, and the Indian come to plead the wrongs of his race should find them; on that separate but more free and honorable ground, where the State places those who are not with her, but against her--the only house in a slave State in which a free man can abide with honor. If any think that their influence would be lost there, and their voices no longer afflict the ear of the State, that they would not be as an enemy within its walls, they do not know by how much truth is stronger than error, nor how much more eloquently and effectively he can combat injustice who has experienced a little in his own person. Cast your whole vote, not a strip of paper merely, but your whole influence. A minority is powerless while it conforms to the majority; it is not even a minority then; but it is irresistible when it clogs by its whole weight. If the alternative is to keep all just men in prison, or give up war and slavery, the State will not hesitate which to choose. If a thousand men were not to pay their tax bills this year, that would not be a violent and bloody measure, as it would be to pay them, and enable the State to commit violence and shed innocent blood. This is, in fact, the definition of a peaceable revolution, if any such is possible. If the tax-gatherer, or any other public officer, asks me, as one has done, "But what shall I do?" my answer is, "If you really wish to do anything, resign your office." When the subject has refused allegiance, and the officer has resigned from office, then the revolution is accomplished. But even suppose blood shed when the conscience is wounded? Through this wound a man's real manhood and immortality flow out, and he bleeds to an everlasting death. I see this blood flowing now. " Henry David Thoreau


some various thoughts 08.Nov.2004 15:35

me dp97232@yahoo.com

I agree that it needs to remain legal. If we resort to illegal methods, police-bashing, demonizing the "other side", etc., then the general public will discredit it and you will have no hope of getting a ballot measure passed, and we'll further polarize our community (large and small). Communicating and gaining the trust of the general public will be challenging enough already.

I am a Portland resident, and those that like to label people would call me "liberal". But I grew up in various rural Eastern Oregon areas. People out there generally do not like being in the same state as Portland, Salem, and Eugene. They generally see people over here as a bunch of radical liberal "tree huggers" out to ram our ways down their throats and minimizing the impact their votes have on their way of life.

In consideration of that, some ideas I would propose would be to divide Oregon and other participating states into very small (county level or perhaps smaller if possible) micro-nations that are organized in a way to support each other in some way (e.g. like a European Union), or have higher levels of government be weak and thin, leaving it to the local communities to define their way of life as much as possible. Those are just some ideas to throw in the big pot for discussion. :)

Unfortunately I cannot go to Pioneer Square saturday, but I've been talking with others over the last few days about working on solutions to the problems we face, including the idea of secession. It will be multi-state, and it will focus on bringing people together, rather than separation and polarity. It would certainly be a place to discuss solutions like this, or like a "Cascadia", or whatever else people come up with. I imagine it's primary focus would be on writing up and passing initiatives in the various states. Oh, and it will be starving for volunteers, forum moderators, facilitators, people with thoughts and visions to share, etc. The site is not up yet so stay tuned for further information. :)

are you a lawyer or have a Cascadian lawyer friend 08.Nov.2004 15:35

Alexandros of Cascadia

we could gather some of those "thousands" of lawyers that were to
watchover the elections and draft how to legally secede the states
that are in Cascadia. Kind of a "Cascadian Legal Brigade".


here is a section of the Oregon Constitution that has been passed down:

" Section 1. Natural rights inherent in people. We declare that
all men, when they form a social compact are equal in right: that
all power is inherent in the people, and all free governments are
founded on their authority, and instituted for their peace,
safety, and happiness; and they have at all times a right to
alter, reform, or abolish the government in such manner as they
may think proper. -- "


Kwanesum Cascadia!


those listening to Air America 08.Nov.2004 15:37

Alexandros of Cascadia

I think we should try to get this issue be it Cascadia and Southern
California, The Great Lakes and Atlantica want to secede. Ed Shultz
and Al Franklin will shoot it down because they are way too attached
to "Americanism" But others might be more willing to say "hmm .. well
I do not know". I believe Randi Rhodes would have at first a knee
jerk reaction of "no" and eventually be convienced, but Mike Malloy
and Janeane Garofalo (who has already voiced that) & Sam Seder would
be far more willing to ponder it and maybe outright suggest it. I
would suggest blogging them or e-mail their accounts. Here is the
basic idea the Blue States being part of Canada would be protected by
NATO and then we can starve the red states out with sanctions until
they re-establish true democracy and practice univerals human rights.
We can also claim our share of the money spent on the military (since
we paid for it as tax payers). This is basic geopolitics ..
Containment Policy which we used against the Soviets.


Cascadia ... meaning? Part 2 08.Nov.2004 15:57

lc

i'm seeing a lot of energy going into this movement. But can someone please answer the question i proposed earlier: What do you plan to do with the MANY people who live within the boundaries of Cascadia, but who don't want to leave amerika -- especially now that Measure 37 has passed in Oregon? These folks are entrenched here!

Fantasy is one thing; reality is something quite different. If this is a playful outlet for your frustrations, i can understand. i have my own.

How many of you claim 'exempt' when you work in the system -- and refuse to pay any federal taxes at tax time? Wouldn't this be an example of actually doing something practical?

Re: Cascadian Flag 08.Nov.2004 16:19

siggy

hi Comrade Lake

another flag? where were these new flags before nov 3rd? i have see the tree tri-color flag and the parody 'republic of cascadia' w/ the sasquatch militia flag for years. but why now do these other people push their flags?

RE: Cascadia ... meaning? Part 2 08.Nov.2004 16:40

someone

RE: What to do with the MANY people who live within the boundaries of Cascadea, but who don't want to leave amerika?

I'm just a person throwing out thoughts here. One idea is to split the states up. An election can be held; local regions that vote to remain, can remain and retain the state of Oregon, Washington, California, or whatever, U.S.A, while other regions move on.

I'm sure others will have other ideas also. My point is there are ways to deal with that.

Why a flag? Flags are associated with patriotism. Patriotism is a dynamic term that changes meaning over time to corral the sheeple. It meant one thing during the cold war, and now it means something totally opposite. Whatever the current meaning is, you must be "patriotic" or you are a scummy lowly person.

Cold water is good for you 08.Nov.2004 17:14

ll

So, you wanna secede? Great. How many of those Kerry supporters out there who "played it safe" by voting for a pro-war Democrat who wouldn't upset Wall Street too much do you think are going to join you? How many of them read The Oregonian and don't even know anything about the election fraud, and think the problem is all those homophobic Christian fundamentalists?

I say, if you wanna actually achieve something, start with something practical, like getting city ordinances passed here in Portland to start resisting the federal government (eg,  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302499.shtml and  http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/11/302501.shtml).

You have to crawl before you can walk. Unless all you wanna do is daydream. If you don't think this is practical, then you'd better come up with something else, or explain how you think declaring "secession" is going to achieve anything.

how secession is going to change anything? 08.Nov.2004 17:53

some kid

secession is the only way to change anything. We march in the streets and we're beaten down. We need an environment conducive to change. Not only can we not pass ordinances, we're having ordinances thrown at us that further the oppression passed. Cascadia isn't like the rest of the US. Cascadia voted for john kerry because more of the same is never good. Cascadia pledged to be there on inaguration day if kerry was elected. I personally didn't vote kerry, but I can understand those who would.

Raj Neeshies 08.Nov.2004 19:25

The Secretary

What to do about the rural vote? Outnumber them! Out flank them! Overwhelm them!

We have an interesting history in Oregon related to the Raj Neeshies about 20 years ago. (Sorry about the spelling.) They imported bus loads of people from all over to overwhelm the vote in the county of their ashram. They almost did it. We could do something like that, first in Portland, then the state. We have a good start as a counter culture center, we just need to expand it by bringing in as many of our friends as possible. Soon we will take over the state even if there is no secession. Might as well bring in our friends now, they will all want to emigrate here later anyway.

There are some very good lessons from the Raj Neeshies and their mistakes. They could have become an important and viable part of the Oregon community, but blew it bad.

Keep up a good public relations campaign. Get a smart, fast thinking, and articulate spokesperson.

Don't use idiotic tactics like they did, poisoning in a restaurant or any terrorist like monkey wrenching. One such tactic destroys months of good PR.

Cascadia Now... 08.Nov.2004 20:07

Ralphie

If we do it county by county, the right wingers won't stand a chance here in Multnomah county. they are far outnumbered. Also, let's not get so bogged down in what cscadia will be, that we never get around to seceding. That's not to say I favor an " No need to plan for victory-GW Bush-Iraq style approach". Rather, let's acknowledge that we don't know exactly how cascadia will work other than it will be better than what has become of the US. Once we have a nation, we can form it as we see fit.

Outflank the rural folks? Why not join forces? 08.Nov.2004 20:12

A dreamer

Don't outflank the rural folks, work with them! If you try and fit in with them (for example dress like them, talk like them, etc.), you might be surprised by how many agree that the US has gotten too big and needs to come down. And any new "government" or whatever we end up with is going to fall fast if we have urban support, but no rural support.

about the right wing 08.Nov.2004 21:12

cascadian think tanker

For one thing, more of the extreme right wing than you think hate the US gov. To them, the idea of secession is old hat. They just don't get fired up about it under a conservative government. If they were left alone for the most part, I doubt they'd gripe much after a while.

Secondly, give them land. I mean this. Nationalize the timber baron holdings, and give acres to the logging workers. This will keep the economy flowing while putting money directly into people's hands. Meanwhile the once-National forests and all old growth forests can finally be saved.

Third, read my lips. NO FEDERAL TAXES. A whole lot o' christians gonna love them low taxes.

Of course, it's only realistic to realize that some people will fight this idea fiercely, having sold their souls to a shallow patriotism, indissolubly linked to the USA. I don't really know what to do about those folks except try to see that there are as few of them as possible when push comes to shove.

If you could only vote Green. 08.Nov.2004 21:44

Red neck

That would be enough.
They already have a flag.

"The CNP, the Cascadian National Party is a new political party representing the peoples of Oregon and Washington that are frustrated with the political, economic, social, and cultural indifference that has been imposed on our land in the last several years and now feel that the "grand experiment" called the United States has become redundant and therefore the time is coming for the states of Oregon and Washington to go their own way. The CNP political leanings are neither extreme left nor extreme right. We have views that adapt elements of Libertarian, Progressive, Enviromental, and Nationalist beliefs. However, the main goal is for our states to gain independence in a democratic and legal manner." - from the website

Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh 08.Nov.2004 22:38

Nagasaki

Secretary,

Nice points about the Bhagwan. There is definitely a lot to learn there for us, not only in his sucesses, but also his mistakes as well.

So far as the ruralites; even those who wear red, white and blue blindfolds are easy to deal with. Think Tank is right; most ruralites know when they are being treated well and will quickly come around to loving the idea if they realize they can live a little better.

As for those who would be more prone to putting up a fight, most of these people will leave long before they fight. Just encourage gay couples, immigrants and other minorities to move into their neighborhoods and to act natural.

I think we'd all be amazed how fast the majority of them would be on the road to move to Alabama or Texa after their neighborhood begins to attract "unsavoury characters".

Re: If you could only vote Green. 08.Nov.2004 23:55

siggy

Red Neck

John the founder of that party has been absent for almost a year and the group was formed under different circumstances. We need to go beyond stupid political parties and now awaken to just getting people together. The "american" system of politics does not really work. For get taht group its time to create something new. I like this idea of bioregionalism but that needs a political dimension.

The American system doesn’t work 09.Nov.2004 01:45

Red neck

I'm right there with you. I love you people (I can say that in Oregon can't I?) and you've influenced me so much. I could out hippie most of you folks even though I come from the punk generation. I've recently moved to Kentucky, the Oregon of the South and we out produce anyone in the nation in Pot.(I not a pot grower) We've got grandmothers teaching Sunday school out growing weed behind her barn, so much for the 'moral majority' down here. We also have the Amish down here reminding us of reality.
We need to be realistic, this is a long march. The most important thing is communicating/articulating the complete failure (liberals worst nightmare) of this Capitalist system. We've got the power now, it not just
the locals rag(newspaper)now. It not just some people standing on the street corner. We really can out communicate them if we stay focused.
A world that's not on a human scale isn't a world worth living in.

Republic of Cascadia 09.Nov.2004 11:00

Anti-Fascist

Official website of the Republic of Cascadia, not updated ina while, but their point still applies now more than ever!


Re: Repblic of Cascadia 09.Nov.2004 12:53

siggy

i hate to tell you anti-fascist that is an old group and if founder has been missing for months. it was only set up for a political party of Oregon and Washington, but needs to include Northern California.

this site is focused on Cascadia being British Columbia as well but its an old site too  http://www.geocities.com/ringfingers/cascadia2.html

this is one of my favorite sites but it might be a little too 'radical' for some people
The Cascadia Media Collective:
Guerrilla Media from Eugene, Oregon (Cascadia)
 http://www.cascadiamedia.org/