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corporate dominance | government | sustainability selection 2004

VotePair -- how to support Nader/CObb and still dump Bush

Kerry needs Oregonian votes but you can vote for Cobb or Nader, but it in another state -- VotePair -- we just passed 10,000 registrants and climbing fast.
Oregon is huge this election.

Kerry will probably take the electoral votes, but the margin is thin.

We still need Nader to stifle corporate beasts and Cobb to save the planet. There is a way to support anti-to help anti-corporate Nader or Green Cobb and still get Kerry the votes, VotePair.org.

We just passed 10,000 registrations at VotePair. One tenth of the way there.

"VotePair.org pairs up swing-state Nader, Cobb, and Badnarik supporters with Kerry supporters in safe states. Paired voters can then communicate with each other and decide to vote strategically: swing-state participants vote for Kerry and safe-state participants vote for Cobb, Nader or Badnarik.

The result? Greater voter support for progressive third parties is recorded in the popular vote, while the preference for Kerry over Bush finds voice in the Electoral College - and therefore in the final election outcome.

You can make your vote for president count by joining the national VotePair campaign and using your vote to defeat Bush while supporting the role of progressive third-party candidates. As we learned in 2000, a few hundred votes in the right states can make all the difference in the world."

Vote smart,


homepage: homepage: http://www.votepair.org

votepair and flawed assumptions 20.Oct.2004 17:34

ex-democrat voter

The votepair concept rests on the fallacious assumption that democrats can be trusted. Many people know better. I can make up my own mind about who to vote for in the state in which I reside.


more fallacies 20.Oct.2004 17:50

oregon voter

" . . . while supporting the role of progressive third-party candidates."

--this statement presumes that votes for said candidates are somehow "causing" the defeat of Presidential tickets such as Gore/Lieberman in 2000,

when 8 million Registered Democrats that year voted Bush/Cheney (just for example).

these "progressives"'s time and energy would be much better spent on simple vote verification, exposure of Electronic Voting Machines, ensuring proper and secure voter registration, and ensuring voter access to polls without intimidation. Any one of these things would produce much more effective blows against Bush (and still excludes any "improvement" of the Kerry/Edwards - DLC presidential candidate campaign platform itself).

independent 20.Oct.2004 18:14


I hooked up with votepair.org and am very glad I did. I was paired with someone in Utah, a Bush state. He used to live in Washington and voted for Nader in 2000. He doesn't support Nader in this election. He was going to vote for Kerry. After several e-mails he and I decided to swap votes. I was very conflicted before this opportunity came. I want Bush out, but don't want to buy into the Dem. fear and vote for Kerry. He does not represent me, Nader does. However I feel my vote for Nader this time around could help Bush. So I will cast a vote in Oregon for Kerry, there will be a vote cast in utah for Nader in my behalf. Actually I don't think we will have a fair or legal election in this country. Probably haven't for some time. I will vote in this election. I have been voting for thirty years. This is however likely to be the last year I will vote in a Presidential election.

just another democratic party scam 20.Oct.2004 19:52


incredibly, there are frightened liberals out there who take this nonsense seriously.

fuck david cobb & moron jr bush

i want kerry to lose, even better, if nader provides the margn of defeat.

kerry is the greater evil

Vote-Swap... 20.Oct.2004 20:45

alsis38 alsis35@yahoo.com

...was crap in 2000 and its crap now. In addition to the fact that there's no way to verify whether your "opposite number" is really going to keep his/her promise, it's just fucking mealy-mouthed. Oh, I'm sorry-- I meant "strategic." :p Either you believe in your own damn vote/candidate or you don't. Yeesh...

Actually...pairing Third Party Supporters with each other 20.Oct.2004 23:37


As I understand it, there's no great publicity about vote pair, and its 2004 incarnation only got going about a month ago, so the folks most likely to hear about it AND be interested in it AND check it out AND sign up for it are pretty much, be definition, people who have a greater than average interest in electoral politics, pursue their curiosity, and follow up on it. These probably are the SAME characteristics of third party voters. So, it would seem, third party voters are more likely to be inclined to participate or come to participate in vote pair than Democrats or Republicans. The Vote Pair website explicitly states, "VotePair.org pairs up swing-state voters whose first choice is Ralph Nader, David Cobb, or Michael Badnarik with safe-state voters whose first choice is John Kerry." But it seems more likely that it actually pairs very progressive and third party supporters in "swing" states with the same kind of people in "safe" states.

Whatever the supposed "checks" and "safeguards" in this system, it seems it would only take one - or, at most, a few - clever people to manipulate hundreds of vote pairs (either directly or by organizing a few hundred people). But, setting that aside for a moment, I'm wondering, what are the likely incentives for sincere people to participate with honest intentions?

I can see how "swing state" voters would be drawn to vote pair. They see it as a way to resolve their dilemma of having to choose between voting for their first choice or voting to defeat Bush. This gives Kerry a vote "where he needs it most" while they maintain having a vote registered for their first choice candidate.

But, are there really many Democrats (or Republicans) who prefer Kerry over Nader and Cobb and Badnarik, but are aware enough to get involved in "vote pair" and trade their votes to help Kerry where it counts? In "safe states", aren't the folks who are most likely to participate in vote pair ALSO those already leaning towards a third party candidate? If that's true, then vote pairing allows these "safe states" voters to vote for their first choice in candidates while reassuring themselves that they've also furthered their higher priority of helping get a vote for Kerry where he needs it most.

It seems to me that, in those situations where the participants are sincere, vote pair most likely pairs third party voters in "battleground states" with third party voters in "safe state". If this is often true, the real result, then, is two people who each really want to vote for a third party candidate (likely, but perhaps not necessarily, the same candidate) end up casting one vote for a third party and one for Kerry.

It may be providing a reassurance to each voter, without which, BOTH may have voted for their second choice, Kerry. Regardless, what seems also likely, but even more so, is that it's taking two third-party voters and giving one of their two votes to Kerry. In this case, a more accurate way of describing and reporting this is to acknowledge that third party supporters and pairing up to give Kerry half their votes.

known abuses of votepair 22.Oct.2004 14:50


Please don't fall for this. While it may have been set up with the best of intentions, it's being used as a scam. There are a number of republican sites encouraging Bush supporters to sign up multiple time to trick Kerry voters into not voting for him, while they still cast their vote for Bush.

This is just one example:

From News Radio 1370:  http://www.wspd.com/bobf2.html

1. Set up a few bogus email accounts on Yahoo or Hotmail. Make up names if you'd like.
2. Go to www.VotePair.org .
3. Select a swing state such as Florida or Pennsylvania where Nader is on the ballot.
4. Select "Nader" as your first choice for President.
5. Enter your name and email address so they can pair you with a Kerry supporter in a "safe state."
7. Confirm your agreement to vote for Kerry in your swing state via the email they send to your account while he agrees to vote for Nader in his safe state.
8. Print your confirmation email.
9. Take your printed email into your bathroom and use it as a substitute for your Charmin.
10. Go to your precinct on November 2nd and vote for George W. Bush.
11. Feel proud that you helped stop voter fraud in the United States of America!

There are other sites as well where people are admitting to signing up with multiple user accounts. Please don't "trade" your vote because you put your trust in a random online stranger.