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Transcript of the Third Presidential Debate

Presidential Debate

Oct. 13
Tempe, Ariz. (Arizona State University)
Participants: George W. Bush, John Kerry
Moderator: Bob Schieffer, CBS
Topic: Domestic policy
 http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6243023/
Candidates' Misleading Assertions Reveal Deep Divide 13.Oct.2004 21:36

Washington Post

Candidates' Misleading Assertions Reveal Deep Divide

By Glenn Kessler and Mike Allen
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, October 13, 2004; 11:51 PM

Facts took a holiday in the final presidential debate, with both President Bush and Sen. John F. Kerry attacking each other with misleading or out-of-context assertions that revealed the deep philosophical divide between the candidates.

Kerry charged that the top 1 percent of income-earners in America got $89 billion of Bush's tax cut last year, while Bush claimed most of the tax cuts went to low- and middle-income Americans "and now the tax code is more fair."

Kerry's statement was correct, but was out of context, while Bush was stretching the truth. Put another way, the top 1 percent got about 34 percent of the tax cut -- and they pay about 35 percent of individual income taxes. The bottom 80 percent pay 14 percent of federal income taxes, but got 32 percent of Bush's tax cut. (The top 1 percent pays 24 percent of all federal taxes, including payroll taxes, while the bottom 80 percent pays 29 percent of all federal taxes.)

Taxes for all income groups have decreased, although the share of taxes paid has gone up by a minuscule amount for "middle class" taxpayers in the 40 percent to 80 percent of income groups, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

In a series of dueling statistics, the two men tussled over Pell Grants to assist college students, proving that either side can find the numbers to put the best gloss on their case. Kerry said, "they've cut the Pell Grants. . . . they're not getting the $5,100 the president promised them." Bush countered, "He said we cut Pell grants. We've increased Pell grants by a million students."

In the 2000 campaign, Bush promised a maximum grant of $5,100 for freshmen. When Bush released his budget in February, it capped the maximum Pell Grant award to $4,050 for the third year in a row, and the American Association of Community Colleges called it a freeze that would be "a severe blow" to students from low-income families at a time of declining state and local support for public higher education. The White House has argued that the program has a $3.7 billion shortfall, and raising the maximum award while making the shortfall worse is irresponsible.

Since 2001, the number of Pell Grant recipients rose by one million, in part -- as Kerry pointed out -- because the program is based on eligibility according to formula, and low incomes can raise the number of students eligible. According to the Congressional Research Service, a change in the formula last year would bar 84,000 college students from receiving any award at all.

Kerry charged that Bush has underfunded the No Child Left Behind Act by $28 billion. His assertion is based on the fact that funding has not reached the level authorized by the legislation -- not uncommon for many bills -- but he neglected to say that funding for the Education Department has increased about 60 percent during Bush's tenure. (Bush appeared to understate the increase, saying it was 49 percent.).

Kerry made two charges about Bush that Bush denied -- that Bush had once said he was "not that concerned" about finding Osama bin Laden and that he had never met with the Black Congressional Caucus. He slightly misfired on one.

Bush said the bin Laden comment was "one of those exaggerations," but in a news conference on March 13, 2002, Bush said when asked about the search for the al Qaeda leader: "So I don't know where he is. You know, I just don't spend that much time on him, we haven't heard much from him. . . . And I wouldn't necessarily say he's at the center of any command structure. And, again, I don't know where he is. I -- I'll repeat what I said. I truly am not that concerned about him."

Bush did meet with the Black Caucus during his first two weeks in office -- on Jan. 31, 2001 -- but Kerry's overall charge was correct: Bush has turned down repeated requests to meet with the group since then. Congressional Black Caucus members have complained since then that not only has Bush refused to meet with them on specific issues, including his plans to attack Iraq, but the White House has often not even responded to the letters.

Bush yet again asserted Kerry's tax-cut rollback would hit 900,000 small businesses. This is misleading. Under his definition, a small business is any taxpayer who includes some income from a small business investment, partnership, limited liability corporation or trust. By that definition, every partner at a huge accounting firm or at the largest law firm would represent small businesses.

Kerry misleadingly suggested his health care plan would provide health care for "all Americans." Most analysts believe the plan would at best reduce by half the number of the 45 million uninsured.

Bush recycled his charge that Kerry voted 98 times to raise taxes. But FactCheck.org, a nonpartisan group, says nearly half were not for tax increases per se and many others were on procedural motions. The Bush total also includes several votes regarding a single tax bill. Bush misspoke when he said Kerry voted against the Homeland Security bill; he supported it on final passage.

Both Kerry and Bush oversimplified the employment picture, with Kerry claiming the number of jobs has fallen by 1.6 million jobs and Bush saying the number of jobs has increased by 1.9 million in the past 12 months.

Kerry failed to note he was talking about private-sector jobs, while Bush was mentioning only a brief window of time. The latest job figures released by the Bureau of Labor Statistics last week showed 96,000 jobs added in September, less than the 145,000 predicted by economists, for a net loss of 821,000 during Bush's tenure.

Bush is on track to be the first president in 72 years to preside over a loss of jobs, though an unexpected upsurge could erase that dubious honor by January. In its February 2002 report, published well after the economic impact of Sept. 11 attacks, the Council of Economic Advisers predicted Bush's economic policies would generate 7 million new jobs.

Kerry's claim that President Bush tried to cut 500,000 kids from after-school programs is accurate: Bush's 2004 budget cut after-school programs from $1 billion to $600 million

While Bush blamed the recession and war for the reappearance of the deficit, this is a rewriting of economic history. Shortly after Bush took office, the White House estimated a $5.6 trillion surplus during the next decade, even as many economists were warning that the economy was wobbly and the stock market was in a swoon from the decline in technology stocks. The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that spending on the war on terrorism and homeland security is responsible for only a small portion over the overall reversal of the deficit, while Bush's tax cuts account for much of the reduction from policy initiatives.

Bush, making his case that Kerry is a tax-and-spend liberal, charged that he has promised more than $2.2 trillion in new spending during the next 10 years. Kerry has disputed that estimate, and Bush's own tax-cut proposals and plan to create private Social Security accounts -- and his spending proposals -- would add more than $3 trillion to the deficit, according to administration figures.

However, Kerry misspoke when he cited a Washington Post article on the issue, adding the figure of $3 trillion on top of the transition costs for private Social Security accounts.

Staff writer Ceci Connolly contributed to this report.

 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A31325-2004Oct13.html

...avoiding the issues.... 13.Oct.2004 22:36

dude

is it just me or did anybody notice how kerry was alot better about directly answering the questions than bush who would stray way off to right field with his answers (pun intended ha. ha.)?

NAACP = Black Caucus? 14.Oct.2004 13:10

debates good for laughs

Correction on the original post, Kerry said that Bush was the first (P)resident that never met with the NAACP, or something to that effect, and Bush countered that it's not true that he never met with the "Black Caucus". I'm not that familiar with either the NAACP or the Black Caucus, but the words "Black Caucus" do not appear on the NAACP homepage, and NAACP is nowhere on the homepage for the Black Caucus. Another instance where Bush counters with something totally unrelated, appearing to the ignorant to have successfully denied an accusation.

 http://www.naacp.org/
(NAACP website)

 http://www.cbcfinc.org/
(Congressional Black Caucus website)