portland independent media center  
images audio video
newswire article reporting united states

animal rights

Deer Hunter

Photos of a deer hunter in action.
Humans are not necessarily the only large predator left.
Photo 29.Jun.2004 17:49

Bite

I tried to upload another photo along with this one, but could not make it work. So here it is. The photo is not doctored, it is the real deal.

The crocodile (alligator?) is about to stuff the deer carcass up under the bank, a typical food storage behaviour.

Someone call PETA!! 29.Jun.2004 21:34

millitant_vegan

How unethical and wrong. Meat is mudrder! Someone call PETA so they can setup a campaign to stop the the killing of wild deer by selfish meat-eating alligators!

Uh oh You got me now. 30.Jun.2004 02:38

Marwanimus

Oh you people are soo clever.
"Your vegan/Vegetarian logic is soo silly1 ANIMALS kill animals so that means we should to!!1!1! LOL DUHH"

Meat does mean murder. Most of the time atleast. Yes I am aware that souls can die accidentally. The idea here is that Animals are also people. In the sense that they must have rights. Why? Because animals can communicate.

 http://www.123compute.net/dreaming/knocking/alex.html Anyone remember Alex the parrot? Alex shows signs of abstract reasoning and can thus think, This commands respect and also proves Descartes wrong about animal inferiority. That is, if we even agree that ones worth is placed on ones ability to "think". I say It's silly to place ones worth on their intellegence anyways. Many problems will come from this mechanistic thinking. Are humans who have downs syndrome worthless? Fuck no. Are humans who sit on their ass all day and watch mtv worthless? Fuck no. Its like looking at a tree and seperating it. Leaves, branches. Put the tree in a 3x3 dirt block in front of the mall. Yeah it'll do great there. Tree's give life to many many other animals and insects, including us. Lets not seperate it.

Like people. Women especially. Breasts, buttox, IQ. Put that women on a 3x3 poster in the same mall. It's whats wrong with the world today. Mechanistic thinking, looking at everything as a peice. Never realizing that putting the peices together is what creates the world. If we seperate the peices than the world will fall apart. We are part of this system that is the world. And if we keep this Cartesian and mechanistic thought going, abandonment of emotion, and imagination. Than we wont help the world and have an equalibrium with it. To do this we must respect animals and enviroment. And ourselves. And thats what being Vegan is about. In the philisophical ethical sense. Atleast part of it. Yeah im omnivorous, But im also intellegent. And my rational faculty helps me come to the conclusion that a lifestyle that has utter lack of respect to enviroment and people around me, is destructive to them and me. I dont want to hurt animals for the same damn reasons I dont want to hurt humans, for the same reasons I dont want to hurt the enviroment. Being Carnivourous isnt nature. Its a decision, But for some animals. It appears to be nature. I wont hold that against them. If we found a way to communicate to a crocodile that its wrong to kill other animals and that its is quite possible for them to live healthily while not killing other animals. Than kickass ill do it. But I dont think so. Not now and not for a damn long time. Especially when these simple concepts seem to difficult to convey to humans who are fully capable of understanding them. We really need to reasses our values as human beings. I see veganism as a healthy step in the right direction. And than I took that step. And now no one is hurt. No im not hurting the people working for the meat packing company. A dying capital system is whats hurting them, that and tv values. But now Im digressing, and the post is done anyways. Later folks.
Anarchy Peace

Missing the Irony 30.Jun.2004 08:54

we have a choice

Looks like someone didn't recognize the irony of "militant_vegan." Both of these are anti-AR posts. All I have to say is that no animal rights activist is calling this alligator's actions unethical. He found a good meal. We have options that aren't available to him. We can eat without taking an animals life, causing unnecessary suffering and pain.

other choices 30.Jun.2004 10:21

millitant_vegan

"We have options that aren't available to him. We can eat without taking an animals life, causing unnecessary suffering and pain."

You are correct. I can instead go to the local grocery store and buy tofu that was processed in a factory using large ammount of energy, packaged in plastic, and then shipped in a refrigerated truck across the country. Or maybe some TVP that was also processed in a plant and shipped across the country. Cleary, the long term environmental damage is better then one dead animal. Or I could buy locally raised free-range meat or go hunt my own meat.

Now, I don't thing veganism is a bad thing. I myself eat no meat b/c of both ethical and health reasons , but I take offense at the general vegan attitude that _any_ meat is bad. I would rather people ate locally, whether that be locally grown vegetables and locally raised/hunted meat then eat processed foods that require large ammounts of energy input. Drastically reducing meat consumption is an important step towards sustainable, environmentally friendly food production practices; but I have yet to see data that shows how completely cutting meat out of our diets is required. Moving to more sustainable and more humane practices seems like a much better solution than an attempt to "convert" meat eaters into non-meat eaters.


Fake AR dork runs on at the mouth; says nothing 30.Jun.2004 11:43

Gilligan Syland

> I can instead go to the local grocery store and buy tofu that was processed in a factory using large ammount of energy,
How much energy exactly?

> packaged in plastic,
Plastic recycles.

>and then shipped in a refrigerated truck across the country.
You buy East Coast tofu? Why? There are a dozen manufacturers between SF & Seattle.

You can make your own, too. It's easy, and no steaming gut-pile (or large amount of energy used). <tee hee>

Militant troll 30.Jun.2004 12:23

MeatPuppet

I'd be very surprised if "Militant Vegan" actually eats no meat or holds the stated beliefs. If that is the case, then you are nought but a wanker for harassing people with which you have much in common instaed of focusing on the unethical aspects of agribusiness.

mmmm, tofu 01.Jul.2004 12:55

strongbad

to militant vegan: you do not need to buy tofu that was made on the other side of the country and then trucked all the way out here. Try OTA tofu, or, there is another brand of tofu that is made here in portland, you can get it at most of the natural food stores. There's also some REALLY tasty tempeh made in eugene that's sold at peoples and at natures.
just remember, buying locally made products supports local people getting jobs!

old thread 24.Apr.2005 20:47

tofu and meat eater

Okay, so nobody will ever see this cause the thread is so old. FYI, even OTA tofu is made from soybeans that are grown in the mid-west. So is Dae Han Tofu (another portland tofu company).