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Indymedia Censors ANOTHER Kerry Post

hey, look, i posted something about Kerry earlier today (not that i'm a big supporter or anything) and there were a lot of responses. I went to read them just now and the entire post is gone. What is up with that?
the post was called "Kerry DOES have and agenda" or something like that.

please explain indy folks. thanks.
I Suspect... 28.Jun.2004 22:05

suspector

...it is because Kerry is a steaming pile of shit, and he was stinking up the wire.

it's on the Selection 2004 28.Jun.2004 22:12

Page

here:


People are Silly 28.Jun.2004 22:13

Censors

It appears if the operater are prudish and aviod controversy at nearly all cost.

The more entertaining the more likely it will be censored. Often if it offends religeon its gone. If too ofensive its gone if there is dead people -that ok some times. No sex ever.

Good example are in compost so its sometime available...
If You Burn a Flag I'll Jail You
If You Burn a Flag I'll Jail You

Thanks Page, How did U Find It? 28.Jun.2004 22:17

RD

got the post, thanks.

get real 28.Jun.2004 22:19

max

get real. No one's censoring your 150 million dollar campaign.

I Am NOT campaigning 28.Jun.2004 22:22

RD

I'm just bringing up the damned topic...

BUT let me point something out to you progressives...America has ALWAYS been a plutocracy from DAY ONE. There has never been a time when this was not true. The lesser of 2 evils sucks, I agree, but it does make a difference. You can have suffering or you can have suffering greatly magnified...which do YOU choose?

Health 28.Jun.2004 22:24

For JK

My health is probably the most important thing to me. Thats why I'm for Kerry.

Actually... 28.Jun.2004 22:36

imcista

I believe RD that your post that you believe to be censored is called, "Kerry DOES stand for something..." and that if you go to the selection 2004 page under actions section on the left side of the page you will find your article there, complete with comments.

Next time instead of crying censorship on the newswire I would suggest e-mailing the hard working folks here at portland indy by going to the contact page (by clicking on the contact link above at the top of the page), and then clicking on feedback (they will be more then happy to sned a reply addressing any questions you might have).

Most comments reguarding kerry, bush, etc are sent to the selection 2004 page. In the past the newswire was being overrun and flooded by posts concerning the presidential selection, and because of that a selection 2004 page was made.

So no your post has not been censored, just moved to the selection 2004 page.

Lets see if this post gets the axe! 28.Jun.2004 22:46

waiting...

Lets see how long this one lasts...
Heinz-Kerry in St. Louis today!
Heinz-Kerry in St. Louis today!

sorry, RD 28.Jun.2004 23:17

max

Sorry, RD. I misunderstood. But if you had read the previous thread that you allude to, about a Kerry posting supposedly being censored here on Indymedia (of all places), then you would have read an Indy editor's response giving a full and detailed explanation of the how and why of postings being moved to the Elections 2004 page. Anything that's not local is moved there. Since you alluded to that previous thread (by saying "another"), I'd assumed that you had read it, and that you were implying that the Indymedia editors were not being honest in their polite and thorough explanation in the previous thread.

Instead, it seems that you just somehow hadn't read their response last time. I would have given you a less pointed retort had I understood that.

As for "us progressives" refusing both degrees of evil, I don't accept one bit that this country is a plutocracy. There is a strong plutocratic political faction that traces directly back to the Tories, the Loyalists, who favored staying under the British Crown. But THEY LOST to the American Revolutionaries. I count myself among the latter faction in American politics. Both factions have been engaged in a titanic struggle over control of this country since DAY ONE, and the Loyalists won a major victory with the Supreme Court's granting of legal personhood to corporations in 1886. But the struggle continues. THAT, in a nutshell, is precisely the line in the sand that Ralph Nader is drawing. The Loyalist/Corporatists against the American Revolutionaries. Which side are YOU on?

There is no viewpoint discrimination by Indymedia editors that I can detect. The whole point here is to facilitate self-publishing, thus open dialogue. I hope we can agree that that is not a "progressive" issue, just a plain democratic one. Since you value free speech, I assume you consider yourself an American Revolutionary, not a Tory. The question, then, is why you feel it is pragmatic or meaningful for you to promote or vote for either one of the two Tory/Loyalist-controlled parties. They constitute only 1/3 of the electorate, and a majority of both of these parties are American Revolutionaries like you and me. The Tory/Loyalists were the majority in 1776. They are now a minority of about 10 to 15%. So we are making progress. But ABB head games and similar BS are the last resort of this despicable anti-American minority we are dealing with in both the Republican and Democratic parties today. They can't control either party with honest and open dialogue and debate, so they use bait and switch, fear tactics, doublespeak, money games, legal loopholes, divide and conquer, etc. etc. etc.

The Nader/Camejo ticket stands for the ongoing American Revolution. We are winning, so let's not fall for their tricks and give up now. In an interview of Dennis Kucinich by Studs Terkel in 1978, Dennis said the American Revolution has never ended, and that his fight against the takeover of Cleveland's municipal power utility was part of the on-going American Revolution. He meant that quite literally. Both Bush and Kerry's roots are firmly planted in Loyalist soil -- they are direct descendants of British and Scottish nobility and their family wealth comes from pre-Revolution old colonial money. Most American megacorporations today can be traced back to Loyalist companies involved in slave trade, opium trade and other trades in semi-competitive collusion with the British East India Company and their foreign partners in China, India and elsewhere. When Nader pledged that as President he would appoint a commission to investigate corporate capital that traces back to the slave trade, in preparation for presenting a Slave Reparations Bill to Congress, he is 100 percent serious, and it's not just blacks he is doing that for -- it's for all of us who value American democracy.

In his speech, Nader said one day when he was a boy he came home from school and his mother asked him, "Ralph, do you love your country?" He said, "Sure, I love my country." And she said, "Well, then I hope when you grow up you'll work hard to make your country more loveable." And that's what it's all about.

What the Democrats and Republicans have done recently in Portland is only evidence that the Loyalists are still agitating to sabotage our democratic processes, and sow distrust in democracy itself. Nader welcomed the dishonest Republicans because they, unlike the dishonest Democrats, had no intent of sabotaging a state electoral process -- and by the time his speech was done everyone was standing and cheering, including one Bush supporter who had told me earlier she just wanted to sign and leave to get away from all the horrible liberals around her. I convinced her to stay and Ralph brought her to her feet in indignation against the corporate takeover of our democracy.

In hindsight they probably should have had everyone sign AFTER Ralph spoke. Then the whole sabotage issue would have been moot.

RD, did you even bother to read 28.Jun.2004 23:23

-

"Indymedia Censors ANOTHER Kerry Post"

So you're referring to this post:
 http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/06/291553.shtml

Where it repeatedly, clearly explains where to find such postings. But hey thanks for cluttering the newswire with "censorhsip" crap instead of bothering to do 5 seconds worth of reading, or contacting the site volunteers through email.

Personally, given this level of attacks on this shit I propose that pdx indy just send all campaign bullshit to the compost bin and tell everyone to find it there. If we're not going to be overrun with Kerry/Nader posts, we're going to be overrun with censorship posts. A troll is a troll regardless of whether they're shilling for Bush or Kerry.

reply 29.Jun.2004 01:09

another imcista

RD is just asking

At this point, the Nader stuff will also be on the Selection 2004 page unless there is something local, like the convention results, or possible legal action by the Nader campaign because of the interference by the Democrats etc. Likewise, important stories related to elections like Diebold and electronic voting will stay on the front page.

Perhaps a couple weeks before the election, the election stuff can just stay on the front and the Selection 2004 page archived.

censorship happens 29.Jun.2004 06:27

J L

Maybe not for this post but censoship does happen for whatever reason.

here is an example of something to be censored.

John Kerry ate a steamy pile of cornbeefed cat shit with a silve spoon and silk napkin.

I Apologize 29.Jun.2004 08:39

RD

OK, I apologize for "crying censorship". Actually, I didn't really think it was censored, but was annoyed that the post was moved from the spot it was located initially. Anywhooo...thanks for that really interesting post max. Makes me feel much more optimistic. I'm going to watch Ralph's speech if I can find it on the internet somewhere.

Also, by saying "you progressives" I did not mean to exclude myself. I'm actually so far politically left that I think I dropped off the scale somewhere along the line.

I promise not to post anything "barbed" like that again...u guys are soooo sensitive.

a little quick to call "censorship", are we? 29.Jun.2004 08:51

eek

Maybe the sElection 2004 page isn't quite prominent enough for some folks. Just maybe.

nader videos 29.Jun.2004 09:22

...

RD,
naders got some speeches if you go to cspan and do a search for nader.
The address is
www.cspan.org

there should be a search box. you can enter nader and find his speeches. i think someons put up some nader stuff on this indy-page too.
also there are some shorter clips of vidoe and audio if you go to the site
www.votenader.org

and look under media clips. i think the longer speeches like on cspan are best though.