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Discourage records selling white power music!

Discourage records is selling music by SKREWDRIVER, a well known white power band, and does not seem to care.
Discourage records on 1737 SE Morrison Street is selling music by white power band SKREWDRIVER, including "Blood and Honour", an overtly racist album. In a recent e-mail confronting the selling of white power music, they replied "It doesn't matter, it's punk rock." What the fuck!!! First of all, punk rock by definition is anti-racist. Secondly, just because SKREWDRIVER may have a "punk" sound, does not mean that they are Punk Rock. Racism and fascism is not an ethic valued by punx. Punx used to wear swastika's on their clothing (as a sick joke for shock effect--which does not justify it)back in th '77 days. Does that mean discourage would be justified in selling Nazi paraphernalia if they chose to do so? Would the Punk/Skin (traditional, anti-racist kind of course) and anti-racist/fascist community let them get away with it? Hell no, we wouldn't. What if Discourage began selling local white power music such as INTIMIDATION ONE, a white power band based out of Portland, that falsely claims to be Oi!? There is no fucking way the local anti-fascist community, let alone local Punx & Skins would allow Discourage to sell thier music. Selling anything of a racist or fascist nature, Punk Rock or not (what ever your definition of "Punk" is) is never justified, and should not be allowed, or tolerated. Call Discourage records at(503)528-1093, or e-mail at  discurge@aol.com to let them know your opposition to Nazi sympathy (that's what it is isn't it? making money off white power music?). Go to Discourage records and demand them to burn or break the fucking albums. Boycott thier shop. Go to Brick Wall records on NE 7th & Dekum instead. Fight white power, and anything remotely related to it, including white power bands, and the records stores who sell the music.

Go to  http://members.aol.com/discurge/ and search for skrwerdrive, and look at new arrivals to see for yourself.
DESTROY FASCISM!!!

question 16.Feb.2004 22:48

meadowland

what makes you think skrewdriver are racist? (they do have a stupid name)

They Look Like Nazis to Me... 16.Feb.2004 23:03

DJ Shadow

Here's some background on this band from a simple search. If it's true that Discourage doesn't care what they are selling (for a hefty profit, with 2 7 inch records priced at $50 each!), that's pretty messed up. They should be given a chance to denounce this kind of crap, and if they don't, they should be called on it.

I found this website:  http://www.resistance.com/skrewdriver/

with this:


Throughout the ages certain men have stepped up at the proper times to guide the Aryan race from it's destructive course
and lead it down the path to salvation. Adolf Hitler, Commander George Lincoln Rockwell and Dr. William Pierce
are all important examples, however no one has ever been able to open as many youthful eyes as Ian Stuart Donaldson. Born in
1957 at Poulton-le-Fylde in Lancashire, England he would become the most popular and loved man in the entire skinhead scene.
In 1982 his band, Skrewdriver, sent shockwaves throughout the entire world when it introduced Nationalist and Racial
lyrics to it's music, something which at that time was unheard of. Their concerts were feared by the left wing, and numerous
protests erupted before every show. Hail the New Dawn was released in 1984, and the band's popularity soared. Skrewdriver
became known in every White country around the globe. From England to Italy, America to Germany, Ian Stuart was at the forefront of the White Power Scene. His attitude can be best described in one of his quotes:


"I am not the type of person to creep and crawl to a bunch of weak-kneed, pacifist lefties
and two-faced Zionists. One must be honest to people about one's beliefs and especially when
the survival of our very race is at stake. I have no doubt that anyone who expounds patriotic
beliefs has a little black mark put against his name, and by now I must have a massive black
mark near my name. C'est la guerre."




Throughout his life Ian released some of the most exquisite pieces of musicianship the skinhead scene has ever heard. Whether it was a Skrewriver Set, a Solo Project or a Compilation his songs never disappoint, each of them containing an uncanny ability to fill it's listeners with courage and strength.

well, their lyrics for one.... here's a racist tune called "white power" 17.Feb.2004 00:16

GRINGO STARS

I stand watch my country, going down the drain
We are all at fault, we are all to blame
We're letting them takeover, we just let 'em come
Once we had an Empire, and now we've got a slum

(chorus)
White Power! Forever
White Power! Today
White Power! Forever
Before it gets too late

Well we've seen a lot of riots, we just sit and scoff
We've seen a lot of muggings, and the judges let 'em off

(chorus)

Well we've gotta do something, to try and stop the rot
And the traitors that have used us, they should all be shot

(chorus)

middle eight:
Are we gonna sit and let them come?
Have they got the White man on the run?
Multi-racial society is a mess
We ain't gonna take much more of this
What do we need?

(chorus)

Well if we don't win our battle, and all does not go well
It's apocalypse for Britain, and we'll see you all in hell

(chorus) x2



Here's more sick, racist lyrics to skrewdriver's hateful songs;
 http://www.azlyrics.us/a06701

what about the 1st amendment argument? 17.Feb.2004 01:30

goldfinger

I agree with the author about "tolerating." But not about "allowing." It's not our place to "disallow" this. This suggests that we can and ought to do something extralegal to suppress it, which I find questionable on any number
of grounds.

I'm as revolted by this shit as anyone. But how do you counter the free speech argument? Yes, you can picket them. You can threaten them with a boycott. Those are all exercising your own free speech rights. But beyond that, if there are customers willing to buy such shit, you can't stop them. I mean, it could just as easily be a bookstore in a super rightwing area selling Das Kapital. I'm sure we'd be outraged if a posse came in and threatened dire consequences to a bookstore that sold radical political literature. I'm not sure it's such a good idea to simply try and suppress such things with force. Rather, confronting it out in the open and ridiculing it is a better strategy, I think.

If you look at East Germany, to take an example, the outright banning and physical suppression of Neo-Nazi agitation hasn't really been effective. Actually, it has just made matters worse by creating an "outlaw" allure in the Neo-Nazi subculture among disaffected working class youth.

fight fascism with fascism? 17.Feb.2004 02:00

walter

you can't destroy fascism by behaving like a fascist. have you talked to the owners of discourage about this? try engaging them in a debate first. you should also know that not all skrewdriver is racist.

what about targetting record shops that sell records on EMI? they do far more harm than some fringe white power group.

skrewdriver is not a threat it's a fucking joke.

Screwdriver is scary and has caused many gay bashings, rapes, and hate attacks 17.Feb.2004 09:53

MIgratory Bird

Screwdriver is not a joke. My big brother was a skin in the day. He went from sharp (skinheads against racial prejudice) to war (white aryan resistance) with screwdrivers and local punk bands efforts. The white power movement has a lot of cash flow. They release a great deal of propaganda which is peddled pretty heavily in our schools against the disenfranchized.

I remember some of the fights we would have. Though eventually my brother did come back around it got pretty intense at times being at the same show, and him booted up to kick ass. He tried to play it down. He said he was white pride and not white power. He still admitted to gay bashing.

Sure capitalism is always preached to us as a point of stopping us. Like capitalism is logical. Yeah, kids making your grown ass clothes is intensly logical. Bullshit! It's funny that you all think that it should stop at picketing or having a friendly argument over this shit.

But when these folks throw bricks in synagogues, attack thirteen year old girls and rape them (they do) and when they come to the schools to befriend the children where are you then? Having a polite discussion. Hate crime rarely end up in our injustice system. Our injustice system is the biggest perpetuator of race crimes, so it always goes unpunished.

A punk shop should know better. If not maybe they should listen to what the roots of punk were really about.

From the pages of archie and mehitabl. "Punk!" sniffed archie.

Editorial control 17.Feb.2004 10:08

Varro

There is a First Amendment argument for *allowing* Skrewdriver's music to be sold and played.

However, an editor, publisher or business owner has control over what can be published or sold under their auspices - and Discourage has every right not to sell Skrewdriver's music based on racist content.

(And any responsible music store owner SHOULDN'T sell it, just as responsible editors shouldn't allow Holocaust revisionist ads in their papers.)

skrewdriver suck 17.Feb.2004 10:55

meadowland

I'm sold. These guys not only have a stupid name, they are stupid people.

get some perspective 17.Feb.2004 15:16

walter

as i said skrewdriver is not a serious threat when compared to the likes of EMI and their connections to the arms industry. lets target all the record stores that stock major labels that are connected to the military industrial complex.

furthermore, skrewdriver may influence a few white power thugs but it is only because of their explicit content that we feel the need to silence them. whereas there are thousands of bands/records labels that influence millions with more subtle messages, encouraging sexism, excessive consumerism, classim and even racism that we let get away with.

don't waste your time on these marginalized idiots or you just end up assisting propagating their appeal.

The point is 17.Feb.2004 17:05

michael b

A fair number of "punks" I've met seem to feel that punk music is somehow more political or inhierently political and as such should be defended purely on the merit of keeping punk political. I don't deny that there have been a great many punk bands with good politics "chumba wumba" and "crass." That all political bands are political for moral and not profit reasons is arguable. Last winter olympics there was this band of snowboarders talking about how thier lifestlye of traveling from mountian to mountain do'ing "snowbunnies" (thier words not mine)getting high, waking up still drunk about noon and boarding all day- was imeasurably hard. To a sound track of POLITICAL new school punk that had an anti capitalist message. The real eye opener for me was the npr interview "Joey Ramone" did with the daily buisiness program on NPR where he went off about how he is and has always been a total CAPITALIST. He talked about the need for everyone to invest in the stock market. He even spouted some trickle down economic bullshit.

I respect people that are tring stop facism. Give the facists no measure. They will devide and attack us. People speak of how we should let them speak- when in fact they mean NOT OPPOSE thier words. Ideas have power and the idea that is racism should be brought to an end. When some kid goes into a place like discorage they expect a measure of political credability. When they come home with a record they bought "because it sounds good" thier world views can be pushed twards racism. It doesn't help that racists activly organize and highschools and colledges. Here at pcc rock creek I've seen thier graffiti. Next thing you know your sister or brother may be hanging out with neo nazis. In lake Oswego and Gladstone many of these Fucks are methanphetamene dealers. This gives them the power to pimp kids minds. I know. My cranked up sister came home one day with a copy of mine koff and started telling me how Hitler was a great and misunderstood man.

harmless my ass. Discorage needs to grow some backbone. Or we need to give it to them.

Oh you won't believe this! 17.Feb.2004 17:28

Anon

Here is a website that is worth checking out to see how the other side of the right-wing coin is milking the punk movements,trying to assert that punk music and culture are rooted in conservative values. What a bunch of shit:

 http://www.conservativepunk.com/

milk the punk movement? 17.Feb.2004 22:04

mb

What the hell are you talking about. Movements have cohierent strategies, shared goals, express some degree of solidarity, and a measure of popular support. Has punk ever been more than a lifestyle? That a number of punk bands make political music doesn't make the punk scene a movement. Agree on some goals
make some progress twards them and people might start to view punk as a "movement." There's as much political folk, rap, blues, and country as thier is political punk. To here you talk punk exists in a vacume and the rest of us are outsiders. Sounds like a scene to me.

Punk 17.Feb.2004 23:12

Sybil

Movements do not necessarily have coherent strategies, shared goals, solidarity, or even popular support. The anti-war movement for instance was made up of everyone from anarchists to liberals, and they definitely didn't all have a single coherent strategy or the same ultimate goals in mind. What about the hippie movement? It was definitely political but as for the ultimate goal or coherent strategy? Can't really say. I think punk is both a movement and a lifestyle, although not everyone who adopts the lifestyle or fashion is part of the movement. And it very much is a perfect strategic target for white power and racist hate groups because of their common membership - dissafected and angst-ridden white youth. So, this is an issue that really needs to be taken seriously. American History X drives it home.

As for the whole free speech argument, Screwdriver can say whatever they want but that doesn't mean that any business or forum must provide a soapbox from which they can spout their hate. I think it's only fitting that if this record store is willing to profit from promoting racism and hate music, that they should suffer the financial consequences. Businesses do not have the right to fuck this world and get away with it!

A line in the sand 18.Feb.2004 17:04

Mb

Sybil

Movements do not necessarily have coherent strategies, shared goals, solidarity, or even popular support.

>Movements that succeed do. It's important to make your politics personal- but when a lifestyle is put before your efforts at change. Your politics become a lifestyle accesory.

is this a joke 19.Feb.2004 15:25

kre kylemory@ziplip.com

OKAY, this may have been a valid concern in the late 70s/early 80s when this band was putting music out, but give me a fucking break. You could just take out SKREWDRIVER and replace it with EMINEM, or PUBLIC ENEMY, OZZY OSBOURNE, or SUICIDAL TENDENCIES and then this discussion has been going on for decades in the public forum that is Washington DC.
The main problem is that when you give into this type of thinking, you are creating many more problems than the one you are trying to solve; how can you expect one individual to objectively know where to draw the line on what should be listened to, watched, or written? Should record storeowners really be held accountable for the music they sell? That seems a little more Third-Reich to me than any SKREWDRIVER album.
Although there are a lot of artists with a political agenda (are any not?), the main focus is always the art. I think your article conveniently overlooks this point and I guess when it comes down to it, it is not just 'right winger' conservative types that are VICTIMS of inane censorship laws, people just have different ideas of what should be censored. There are always going to be things in the world that you find ugly and wrong, just learn to turn your head the other way and not try to preach your own ideals on others.

Also, I thought you could use this list of other OFFENSIVE record stores that sell SKREWDRIVER albums.

 link to www8.gemm.com

thanks for the misquote and representation mickey 22.Feb.2004 14:38

paul from discourage discurge@aol.com

just to be clear, I've spent several hours over the last 8 years discussing this issue with a fairly wide audience and feel misrepresented by the author that began this thread. He deliberately misquotes us and completely turns a blind eye to any school of thought but his own. I'm going to post all of the correspondence I've had with him as well as one other fellow. You'll note that on no occasion did I say "it doesn't matter, it's punk rock". I openly invite everyone seeing this to come in and have a chat about this in the store. It's pretty easy to slander when you're clickety clacking away with no accountability. For the record..this is the second incident in 8 years we've had concerning this issue. Three LP's the first time (I believe it was 2 by the Klansmen and one Skrewdriver record), and this one LP (skrewdriver's "Blood and Honour") the second. That's 4 records out of probably some 50,000 total sold. These were the only two occasions we've put overtly racist secondhand records (as far as we can tell) on the floor. We were given an ultimatum the first time by Tribal War. Either we pull the records out and convince them that we're ignorant to the issue or they pull their distro out of our shop. It was decision making time. How can we allow anyone dictate what punk rock we make avialable to our customers. It's not our responsibility to hide the grotesqueness of the past or present. It turned out that the majority of response we got from our decision, from the actual record buying public was in favor of non-censorship. I think that mickey's sentiment is positive, but reactionary. I appreciate the stir. It's good stimulation. As far as y'all's namecalling and shit...just grow the fuck up.

"punk rock by definition is anti-racist"
I looked up punk rock and didn't see this anywhere in the definition.

on to the  correspondence------mickeyfitz32@hotmail.com

MICKEY FITZ-----What the hell are you doing selling SKREWDRIVER records?

P-business.

-------They are an an extremely racist band that should not be tolerated under any circumstances. I don't care how rare the fucking albums are, or how "punk" they sound. They aren't punk, they are fascist, and they have paved the way for many young, niave kids into the white power movement.

P-so there are less racist bands, or bands who promote sexism/rape/murder (if it's a cop), however thickly veiled that are OK to sell in our shop? come on. you've got one whipping post and you all wait to jump on the political high horse if you see the word skrewdriver or ian stewart. No doubt their message is ignorant and hateful and not tongue in cheeck. I'm not defending skrewdriver. I'm defending the rights of our customers. So that they may be able to buy whatever they want at whichever end of the political spectrum the "punk" or "rap" or "oi!" record may lie. I wasn't aware that "fascist" was a type of music. If I really thought that any of our customers were so naive as to be recruited into the white power movement because of some stupid message on some stupid record I would reconsider the policy of non censorship. But seeing how intelligent the majority of our customer base is, at this point I feel like letting it be.

----------Local white power band INTIMIDATION ONE falsely claims to be oi! Are you going to sell thier albums? By selling white power music, you are not only tolerating it, you are accepting it. You are giving them a means to be heard, and to spread their hateful ideas. They are slowly trying to creep their way back into the Punk scene, showing up at shows, leafleting neighborhoods, trying to recruit. You are sending a message that they are welcomed in our community. You may not support thier ideas or politics, but you are tolerating it, and giving them the message that they are welcome. Is this the image you want? You may not give a shit, but many of your customers do, and this is the image you are gaining.

P-I don't know much about intimidation one..I've heard the name of course.. We're not interested in supporting their cause in buying new product from any RAC organization.
I think that it's just as possible that someone buy this record purely for novelty (shock) value as it is that someone will buy it and raise their glass in singalong with Ian and the boys. Whatever their reason, they have a right to buy it if they want it. You're probably acquainted with the person who's collection this was purchased with..Long time portlander. he's a really nice dude who had one dark cloud in this 200+ piece pile he brought in for us to sell.

------ You have the right to sell white power music if you want, but you risk losing the business of many of the punks, (anti-racist) skin, and anti-fascist who support your shop. What's worth more to you, selling a $50 dollar SKREWDRIVER album, or losing the business of many of your faithful customers who easily spend more than $50.

P-Those customers are completely entitled to make thier judgements and decisions. We feel like a campaign to damage our business is counter productive. there are thousands of records moving through this door every year with a positive message for every dozen or so that the majority of the population consider negative. Think for yourself. Have faith that the rest of the punks can do the same.



------FREE MUMIA-ABU-JAMAL!!!
------DESTROY FASCISM!!!

-------However, don't assume that I'm not concerned with more subtle shit because I'm not calling you on it. "Business" does not justify tolerating, or support racist and fascist material, music, messages, etc. I don't buy, listen or support any bands that promote racism, classism, or sexism, and niether should you.

P-why haven't you (or your faction) spoken up before? we haven't heard a word about anything else we've sold in the past 10 years (besides that the shit's too expensive). You only raise a fuss if it strikes your particular chord. You were heard.


--------If you had any kind of conscience you wouldn't sell that shit either, but that is your choice. My concern is that your selling music that promotes racism/fascism, classism, sexism, homophobia, etc. You are condoning it, and justifying it through business. I'm also concerned with the people who would want to by this crap. You are sending a message back to the local fascist/racist community that they are welcomed.

Exactly. we don't have the time or patience to dig into the lyrical content of every record that comes through the door. We're not going to start drawing lines. If you actually bought records from us in the past, sorry you werent informed of our policies. I'll get the phone number of whoever buys this crap for ya so you can tell them how concerned you are. I honestly doubt that the fascist/racist community in portland knows we even exist. We're not condoning or supporting fascism by selling this record. that's the end from here...I'd prefer it if you came in and talked to us in person. I don't have time to discuss this via e-mail any further.

AND ANOTHER GUY
In a message dated 2/16/04 11:52:19 AM,  blacksheep3639@yahoo.com writes:



Perhaps you would like to tell me why you are selling white power music. (skrewdriver, blood and honour). Being a record store that predominatly sells punk rock, it would seem to me that your customer base would have huge problem with this being it's exact opposite on the political spectrum. I am so fucking sick of people trying to sneak this bullshit in there stores under the guise of it's proprietor either abstaining from their politics or denying them under the argument that the band isn't really racist because it's there earlier material that doesn't speak of anything racist. (which is an entirely new argument alltogether). One, if I do not recieve a response, or if two, I recieve a response contrary to my argument I will never purchase from you again, and I will tell eveyone I know to do the same, and tell them to tell everyone they know to do the same as well.

I have heard that you sold this crap by many people that have been in your store.

It would seem to me that with people already aware and pissed off at what your doing that you would choose not to sell this material. In closing immediatly after finishing this letter to you I will inform your competitor(s) and all other said sources of this occourance,

and will reneg upon your choosing not to sell racist material again,also I will ameilorate any negative P.R I have dispersed. (Brick wall is cheaper anyway).
Kirk

Kirk.
First of all, regardless of the political import the skrewdriver you refer to is PUNK ROCK. We've discussed this issue to the point of blue face in the past and don't have any kind of definitive answer for you. Lots of opinion though. Personally we (Abe King and I, Paul Anson) don't agree with Skrewdriver's sentiment. There are, unfortunately, hundreds of band's & records that we don't see eye to eye with in our shop on any given day. I know that somehow racism is more deeply disturbing to the punks than say the sexism of GG Allin or the mentors, or the preachy fucking jock mentality of some sxe out there. Fact is, there's shitty punk rock everywhere. It just so happens that SKREWDRIVER are the most high profile. Bring in a list of records you'd like to see banned and believe me we can double it. We've got customers worldwide of all backgrounds buying from the entire spectrum of PUNK ROCK. Someone out there wants it. Their reasons for wanting it ARE NONE OF OUR BUSINESS. We won't knowingly support any RAC organization by buying their product new because yeah, it's bullshit.
I don't think I know who you are, but you're welcome to come down and talk this out anytime. Maybe you can help us draw the line of exactly what's ok and what's not to sell in our store.
It's cool that you'd rather buy from brickwall too.. We're not trying to "compete" with anybody. I personally know all involved and I really wish them the best.
please don't judge us independently of the store. It's been a business decision to serve EVERYONE. Our intent is not to offend. We didn't "sneak" this record anywhere..it's available for all to see. We're not closet or any other kind of racist or sexist or any other slanderous remark you may want to make about us.
yours truly
Paul

http://www.discourage.gemm.com
503-528-1093
1737 SE Morrison Street Portland Or 97214