Why No Outrage Oer A21 Fascist Pig Tactics?!

i don't advocate violence, and believe that last sentence is probably figurative exhuberance. (it is, isn't it?) but i was there and saw the same thing this person describes. the military machinery of the state was brought to bear upon people for being in the park after the event. they were, indeed, spoiling for a fight. word came over the line that their plan was to retreat briefly, and then the second someone stepped into the street, they would attack without mercy. moments later, without even waiting for anyone to set foot int he streets, they swooped in and attacked. everyone who was there saw the same thing, and most of us videotaped it. yeh, we know what happened. i think we have fatigure and are desensitized these days, being exposed to so much police brutality of late. since no one was actually shot, and no infants were pepper sprayed this time, we're kind of calling it good.

but you're right, comrade, it isn't good, is it. i think i'm gonna need to sit down and consider this for awhile. you're right. i can't just let this pass. i'm not planning to "kill the pigs," not by any means. but i'm not gonna sit here and take this, either.

The point of the "Your sexy, your cute, take off your riot suit." is to make them laugh. When people laugh, they can't help but break through a little of the conditioning that has turned them into violent robots.

Any revolution that doesn't transform those who seem stuck within the system will fail.

The systems WANTS you to veiw the other as less than human. It also wants them to veiw YOU as less then human. If you refuse to internalize the depersonal quality of the system, you effectively rip it down.

The SYSTEM is NOT the acts of the conditioned, it is the process of conditioning. Both yours and the cops.

You kill a cop, get ready for the three bags of fluid to be dripped into your veins.

Postman, this isn't Texas under Shrub. The death penalty should be called "assisted suicide for middle-aged murderers who don't want to finish a life sentence."

There is outrage here, and I will suggest anyone with stills or video to call Alan Graf (503) 452-2375 for civil actions, and Stu Sugarman (503) 234-2694 for defense of criminal charges.

As to outrage, I am still outraged over Thursday, and still outraged over A22 (some of the offending cops were in the Alpha RRT outside the Chiles Center, including the baby-sprayer, Kelly). But it's more effective to plan your next move than rant and rave.

This article is a hateful piece of garbage, and the author is a provocateur. Comrade Red should know from his marxist training that police are just workers who have been brainwashed like the rest of us idiots. Of course, it could be that Comrade is not a comrade at all, but an agent of the bourgeoisie. Or the fascist junta. Or better yet, the police themselves.

Seriously, this kind of hatred is designed to tear us apart.

I spoke w/cops as I encountered them on the streets of Portland in the days leading up to the Bush visit. Their attitude was, "hope it comes and goes quiet." One remarked that he didn't know why the animosity toward the cops, "I didn't vote for the guy (Bush)." My take is that some people wanted to get a gratifying reaction from the cops. Cops are like anybody else. All this nazi, facist etc. language just doesn't wash. I hitchhiked all round the country, got into a lot of scrapes as hippy, counter culture guy, non-conformist and all that. Met punk cops, tough guy cops, old cops, racist cops etc. My invariable experience was that they were like everybody else in the world, generally treat people the way people treat them.

Cops are not "like everybody else in the world". They are paid to repress, injure, and kill citizens. And they punch the clock and treat it as a job. They are individually responsible for their actions. If they pepperspray a baby, it's because they think it's just fine to do so. If they shoot and kill a young black woman for trying to drive away from a routine traffic stop, it's because they think it's okay to do so. They will be held accountable.

First of all for the radical cheerleaders, yes you made the cops laugh, that must have been nice, I didn't see it stopping them from pepper spraying people for sitting in the park. You really think you're going to win them over? Do you think that one day one of them is going to come over to our side? As for cops just being working class joes, just doing their job, that's pure bullshit. The guy who ran over Rachel Corrie with a bulldozer was working class, should we be trying to organize him into a party? Sure if you talk to them on the street they'll say, "oh I hope everything goes quitely during this protest, I didn't vote for him, blah blah blah.", but our experince proves what a load that routine is. May I remind you that these are the people who put out the 'Smoke 'em, Don't Choke 'em' t-shirts, they are not the same as construction workers or taxi drivers. Spend just a few hours in of their stations and you will see that they are scum who revel in beating; balck people, hispanics, anarchist, hippies, old women, young girls, homeless people and anyone else they think isn't a red blooded patriot american. If my anger offends you, I'm sorry, I'm afraid I can't just goove on my love beads or channel my anger into a purple crystal or whatever the pacifist do these days. Thank you sorry for the trouble.

The cops are often like any other young person who is idealistic, they start out wanting to do good things and thinking that cops are always the good guys because that is what saturday morning cartoons told them.

Then they get in the system and realize it is not always true. Some leave, some try to stick it out and change things from within, some just try to stay together long enough to retire and send their kids off to college so they don't have to become cops, and some sadly turn into violent nazis.

We saw some of the worst in cops that Thursday, but there really are good ones out there. Condemming all people who wear badges as facists is just as misguided as condemming all people who march in protests as rioters. It is true a certain percentage of the time, but how would you feel if you attacked one of the good ones because you did not like the uniform he was wearing?

Judge people by what they do as individuals, don't be a lazy ass and just condem them all. Don't use the same logic against cops that the KKK uses against black people, because it just does not work. Find the specific ones that fuck up, go on down to the D.A.'s office and file a criminal complaint (bet you did not know that you have the same ability to file a criminal complaint that the cops do, did ya? They fill out the same paperwork as we can, and you can press charges as easily as them). Then after you drag that cop in front of a judge for a criminal trial, sue his ass in state court for violating yoru Oregon constitutional rights. After you clean his bank account out that way, sue his ass in federal court for the same thing. Three court cases is enough to cause even the worst Nazi to go scurrying away from law enforcement forever. Do this a few times, and you will be surprised how fast the police department dusts off the constitution and goes back to protecting and serving.

Comrade Red wrote, "First of all for the radical cheerleaders, yes you made the cops laugh, that must have been nice, I didn't see it stopping them from pepper spraying people for sitting in the park."

No, the cheerleaders won't win them over, but I doubt that's the intent. The Radical Cheerleader, Code Pink, and others are there to make everyone think, and maybe laugh and lighten up. "Everyone" means you, me, the cops, other protesters, counter-protesters, non-protesters, the opposition, etc. Not everyone will get the message, but I think they're a good influence and much needed.

Good grief, many of us are very angry and very serious--and rightfully so. We need a little humor and diversion. I think that the Cheerleaders and Code Pink also put on a more approachable face for the public at large. We have many messages and there are a number of ways to communicate them. Thank goddess for Code Pink and the Radical Cheerleaders!

Teddy Ruxpin says, "Don't use the same logic against cops that the KKK uses against black people..." Isn't this beyond apples and oranges? One is born lighter brown or darker brown, but one CHOOSES to be a cop. When one chooses to be a cop, one buys into the job of repressing the public. It's actually pretty simple.

While I agree with the idea of holding cops accountable, it's a daunting task to try to haul a cop through the legal system--especially when that system will support the cops every step of the way. After all, the cops are tools of that system. Suing the cops, etc., isn't exactly like running out for groceries, it takes lots of time, effort, and money. Still, the concept is valid.

With regards to attacking one of the good ones because don't like the uniform, how do we tell which are the good ones? They all look scary in their riot gear and I'm sure every last one would pull the trigger on the pepperspray. To assume otherwise is silly.

In my opinion, they grouping themselves by association, not me. I have a hard time seeing the goodness and humanity through the uniform. I have had a number of first-hand experiences with cops and their lying and their violent behavior. I'm not a young hot-head radical (not trying to create a stereotype, just making an example)--I'm a middle-aged, middle-class, white male.

Agreed, it is wrong to call all cops fascist. Most are not....yet.
But most are the willing armed tools of the state. And this state is, at least, toying with fascism.

Maybe their mothers loved them. But that is irrelevant.

And to the title of the original article:

Why no Outrage over A21 Fascist Pig Tactics?

That is a good question. Because they WERE fascist pig tactics. Some, like me, might be a bit hardened to the ugly realities of the world as it exists today, so are not as surprised as others by flagrent repression in the belly of the Empire. But, we should all be OUTRAGED!

These activist do not see us as an inconvenience that they have to deal with, they want a fight! The activist pigs couldn't just let the day end uneventfully they had to show us who was boss. By Zeus, did no one notice this? These are the same fuckers who put out the "off the pigs" t-shirts after watching us risk our lives every day, doing what we can to help, what we hope, tho don't always know, is right! Do not attempt to reason or humanize these animals they are a whole 'nother breed not related to human beings. I have been in their blak bloc houses, seen their rant sessions they are like a sick twisted cartoon show; there is no trace of humanity in their beings. And on a side note it doesn't help to have the radical cheerleaders chanting, "Your sexy, your cute, take off your riot suite." at these animals, they are non-persons and we should get together for beer and pizza whenever one gets shot. No sympathy for these losers, none! Do not humanize them, do not try to reason with them, they are equal to child molestors and mass murderers. Good activist, bad activist they're all activist, kill 'em all. Thank You.

hey there, comrade red, i changed your little fascist rant around a bit, just to make a bit more pertinent, close to home, scary maybe. I also fixed some of your spelling, added a bit of punctuation, etc. i see that you've discovered the basis of every revolution so far: SOS. yes, friend, the Same Old Shit. kill, kill, kill. blah, blah, blah. killing people is hardly ever the answer, even with cops. most cops don't even deserve killing. Most of them, in fact, are good people, if a little thick in the skull, prone to hardline bullshit, such as you are, apparently. this kind of shit gets us nowhere, ever, ever. you, pal, are a sad kneejerk bad-spelling motherfucker whom I'm hoping was just drunk & pissed off when you posted this drivel.

& one final thing, comrade, have you read of Stalin? Of the Cultural Revolution? Do you really want to be that kind of human? Do you? My mother always told me "Never trust a man who calls himself comrade."

I find that I still believe her.

ah shit, folks... i just noticed that i missed several typos in my (& comrades) last entry. I'm just not as cool as i thought. o well, who gives a shit? i do & i don't. maybe we should discuss rules of english here, instead of caveman police actions, activist whinings. it would all be so much easier to change. it really would. this entire posting is spurious redundant masturbation; all of it, yours, mine, everyones.

my mother always said "if one is going to grab the tiger by the tail, then one should expect to get maimed."

It can't be so hostile. Ed's suggestions make use of what we've got (numbers), and make such use of it that it makes it even more brutal when they DO finally charge and attack. Consider the history of nonviolence, and consider whether America would have been stunned to see black folks cut down like windrows if they'd had guns or bats. It is dignity that makes nonviolence work. Without that, it's a waste of fucking time.

I think they were pissed that we stopped that donor bus shortly before this happened. We made them look bad and they were trying to make up for that. They were probably making jokes about us while we were freaking out the donors on the bus and in the end we have the last laugh. Ha Ha.

This is true that people chose to become cops, while blacks are born that way, so my KKK comparison is not wholly valid. And yes, it is damn near impossible to tell the (few) good ones from the massive amount of bad (or apathetic, which is just as bad) ones.

But I am an idealist, I know it is naive of me and not likely to be applicable in real life, but if for no other reason then to feel better about myself and to hold the "moral high ground," I refuse to condem them all. 90%, sure, but just not all. I do not hold it against those of you who do condem them all, frankly they have given us little reason to think otherwise, but that way of thought is just not for me.

And yes, dragging them through the courts is a daunting task, but so is marching, getting arrested, going to jail and defending yourself in court. If we are willing to do all that to change the system, we should be willing to fight them their way as well. Changing soceity is not easy, it never was, but I feel we have a duity to do something about the criminal cops, and that means trying like hell to send them to jail no matter how hard they make it for us.

Cops work for the state - is this how 'working class' is defined? People who work to control the public and often oppress and take their rights away, beat them? That's working class? Sure, lots of good and admirable cops out there. Cops have saved people's lives and protected them from criminals. But these aren't 'working class.' They make a lot more money than people like teachers or janitors but still often live outside the city they work in.

They are not a PART of the community, they are against the community, except when it comes to things like catching the local teenager who stole something, or tracking down the local sex offender. But if cops beat up a black kid, like they do here in Oakland every day, the 'community' is their enemy, and is completely powerless to do anything without many many nights at city council meetings, fighting for the police oversight that's needed, getting tossed fake commissions that disband after a few weeks, etc., etc. I saw a recent mild beating take place on the news and do you know why I saw it at all? Because the guy filming it had a memory chip in his camcorder that the cops didn't see when they confiscated it after the beating. This happens every day and we don't see it in the news.

Do YOU consider these rows and rows of storm troopers to be A PART of your community?

Some of the most dangerous projects in inner cities have been brought under control by UNARMED but respected community members who interevene.

Cops are told what to do by rotten politicians and they do it. Not all. Some call in sick, or get other duty. But lots of them are Republicans that are glad to stomp on civil liberties and do things like tail people who are activists.

When was the last time a cop SPOKE OUT against their own system of repression and beatings?

I guess - like the politicos - they know who's got the guns.

Yes, I am a fan of Comrade Stalin, I think the cultural revolution was a bit ultra-leftist though. Oh yes, I was drunk when I wrote the orginal post but light intoxication often makes one more honest I have found. I stand behind my statement even if it was a bit, 'foaming at the mouth'. That was clever how your changed my post around to make it aginst activist, your mother must be proud. As for you new age pascifist who are against any kind of violence whatsoever that is your privalege, being a resident of a liberal imperial power, it doesn't do much for the half of the world starving to death under brutal colonial regimes. Of course your all going to say this the same old rehetoric of 'evil dictatorships' and whatnot, but when was your last revolution? Or are you still waiting for the 100th monkey, what about the 100th Charles Manson or the 100th Aldolf Hitler, my god you new agers are the greatest sign of the sickeness of western society. Again I just can't groove on my love beads and blow bubbles, sorry if that offends your soft liberal sensiblities, those traits that make the left in Portland so impotent but so dammn hip.

why be a new age hippy pascifist? because this shit that's going on in the world has been going on for centuries upon centuries, just different faces that's all. yes, i know, it is just this kind of apathy that allows the 'fascist nazi pigs' in power to continue brutalizing the people. its not that i dont care though. i actually find it all to be pretty damn entertaining, the events in the world, the politics of the time. it's an exciting time to be alive. nothing to be taken too seriously though, no one gets out of here alive. what if you were to somehow magically 'change the world' you couldnt take it with you, and besides the world is changing everyday. it's not about changing the world, no, it's about how you deal with what life hands you each moment. it is the most irresponsible thing to blame all of your problems on the world or expect somebody else to 'save' you from these problems. nobody wants to truly stand up on their own two feet and see through their own eyes. dehumanizing 'the Man' is dehumanizing yourself, come on two wrongs dont make a right. that's what they do to you, look at you, perceive you and believe you to be less than human, or whoever else is in their crosshairs (like the iraqi's) and can their fore digest their orders more easily to beat you like wild animals and serve those they are hired by, $$$$. violence and anger are effects of fear. in order for the 'movement' to be truly effective, it needs to be done without fear and with much love. because afraid, and angry, and violent, is just what they want you to be, just so they'll have more of an excuse..........