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Governor Ryan of Illionois

Governor Ryan of Illinois has commuted all Illinois death sentences during his last days in office.
If you cross a reptile with a toad you get Governor Ryan.

He needs to be immediately excommunicated from the Republican Party. Anyone who's had the misfortune to shake hands with him during the past week should take a bath.

The turd has completely disregarded the intent of the laws in Illinois. He's perverted the clemmency statute and It will need to be revised.

I wouldn't put him in the same category with Al Queda. He's about half a notch better than them.
I agree 11.Jan.2003 20:27

someone

Assuming there is such a ritual of excommunciation within the republican party (and I wouldn't be surprised), Governor Ryan is a prime candidate. Afterall, we all know there's no place in the republican party for people of conscience or independent thought. Maybe after Ryan, the party can go after McCain with his heretical notions of campaign finance reform and cutting greenhouse gas emissions.

So THAT'S Where republicans Come From 11.Jan.2003 20:40

Den Mark

So, crossing reptiles with toads begets republicans. I always wondered where they came from.

Of course, for the rest of us, we know why George Ryan had no choice but to do what he did. As he put it: "Bad lawyers, bad prosecutors, bad police, bad judges ....." Their corruption gave the governor no choice.

And this is just the beginning, the beginning of the end for capital punishment.

So THAT'S Where republicans Come From 11.Jan.2003 20:43

Den Mark

So, crossing reptiles with toads begets republicans. I always wondered where they came from.

Of course, for the rest of us, we know why George Ryan had no choice but to do what he did. As he put it: "Bad lawyers, bad prosecutors, bad police, bad judges ....." Their corruption gave the governor no choice.

And this is just the beginning, the beginning of the end for capital punishment.

I was surprised too. 11.Jan.2003 22:51

FIX THE PLUNGER

Coming from Illinois and knowing of George Ryan, and knowing of his past corruptions (license for money scams that were traced back to him that allowed an illegal truck driver to kill a family on a freeway) among others. I was surprised he decided to take the system on. Sure this took him years to finally release a few of the men that were wronged by our system that is filled with illegal search and seizures, illegal interogations and so on. Don't forget about the ill prepared mostly incompetent lawyers that are supposed to defend the obviously defenseless. Atleast he was good enough to admit there are huge gaps in our justice system that is working against the people it was set in place to serve. I would love to see Bush or most other Republicans stand up against some of the injustices that they see our system give out, but of course Bush is a person that wants the status quo to keep rolling on, like one big ball of red tape.

The Gov 12.Jan.2003 07:32

Bush Admirer

Governor Ryan: "I have read, listened to and discussed the issue with the families of the victims as well as the families of the condemned. I know that any decision I make will not be accepted by one side or the other. I know that my decision will be just that - my decision ? based on all the facts I could gather over the past 3 years. I may never be comfortable with my final decision, but I will know in my heart, that I did my very best to do the right thing. "

English Translation: "I will know in my heart that I did my very best to do the right thing for my own personal future. I was a tiny little blip on the political radar screen, and one with a pretty hefty scandal tied to him to boot. I don't like shelling out pills for sick people so I had to do something to make a living. Just from the moratorium, those speakers' fees were incredible!!! I can't wait to see what I can charge now! And the possibility of the hundred grand from the Nobel Peace Prize...well, who could resist that? Now I have a legacy. Screw those victims; they're already dead."

More on Toads and Reptiles 12.Jan.2003 07:44

Bush Admirer

Reptiles have forked tongues and slither along on their bellies. They're sometimes dangerous, preferring to ambush their enemies by crawling out from under a rock unexpectedly. James Carville and Hillary Clinton come to mind, perfect examples of a Washington Reptiles.

Toads are generally harmless, though rumor has it that you can get warts from touching them. They're uglier than reptiles and not very smart. They prefer to slink around at night and eat bugs. Al Gore is a typical Washington Toad.

When you cross a toad with a reptile you get something both ugly and dangerous. Gov Ryan fits the description to a T.

so essentially... 12.Jan.2003 08:40

this thing here

... B.A. is arguing for the state of illinois to put to death possibly innocent men. in B.A.'s world, there isn't the standard of guilt known as, "beyond a reasonable doubt". in B.A.'s world, all men on death row are there because they are guilty. because they are on death row. that's the standard B.A. opperates under. "well, they wouldn't be there if they were'nt guilty, right? even if they're innocent of the crimes they've been charged with, there's still probably some reason to put these men to death. it really doesn't concern me. kill 'em all, innocent or not." in B.A.'s world, the legal system of this nation, and the state of illinois, makes absolutely ZERO mistakes. "you can put all your money and your life on that", boasts B.A. that's called standing up for principles, isn't it B.A...

One strike and you're out 12.Jan.2003 09:14

Metal Pan

As far as I'm concerned, if the legal system has sent even ONE innocent person to the death room (and it has, it's been proven and admitted) then that is reason enough to never send another. The logic here is as simple as logic gets and needs no further extrapolation. The system isn't perfect. Death is the end. The system cannot reverse itself after it has murdered someone. Therefore, it has no right to murder.

> Metal Pan 12.Jan.2003 10:23

Bush Admirer

There is no evidence that any innocent person has ever been executed in the United States. None, nada, zippo, zilch.

To learn about the death penalty read this paper:
 http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

We have a criminal justice system that is wildly tilted in favor of the defendant. How else could an obviously guilty perpetrator such as OJ Simpson evade justice?

For starters the jury is instructed to presume innocence unless proven guilty by a unanimous vote of all 12 jurors. The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt 'beyond a reaonable doubt.' And we've all seen what a flim flam con man like Johnny Cochran has been able to do with 'reasonable doubt.' After conviction the defendant is entitled to seemingly endless appeals. It's comical in a sick sort of way. Depraved murderers like Wesley Cook (the jerk who calls himself Mumia Abu Jamal) have made a laughing stock of our justice system.

And then along comes Governor Ryan. Geez.

> Metal Pan 12.Jan.2003 10:24

Bush Admirer

There is no evidence that any innocent person has ever been executed in the United States. None, nada, zippo, zilch.

To learn about the death penalty read this paper:
 http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

We have a criminal justice system that is wildly tilted in favor of the defendant. How else could an obviously guilty perpetrator such as OJ Simpson evade justice?

For starters the jury is instructed to presume innocence unless proven guilty by a unanimous vote of all 12 jurors. The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt 'beyond a reaonable doubt.' And we've all seen what a flim flam con man like Johnny Cochran has been able to do with 'reasonable doubt.' After conviction the defendant is entitled to seemingly endless appeals. It's comical in a sick sort of way. Depraved murderers like Wesley Cook (the jerk who calls himself Mumia Abu Jamal) have made a laughing stock of our justice system.

And then along comes Governor Ryan. Geez.

> Metal Pan 12.Jan.2003 10:30

Bush Admirer

There is no evidence that any innocent person has ever been executed in the United States. None, nada, zippo, zilch.

To learn about the death penalty read this paper:
 http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

We have a criminal justice system that is wildly tilted in favor of the defendant. How else could an obviously guilty perpetrator such as OJ Simpson evade justice?

For starters the jury is instructed to presume innocence unless proven guilty by a unanimous vote of all 12 jurors. The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt 'beyond a reaonable doubt.' And we've all seen what a flim flam con man like Johnny Cochran has been able to do with 'reasonable doubt.' After conviction the defendant is entitled to seemingly endless appeals. It's comical in a sick sort of way. Depraved murderers like Wesley Cook (the jerk who calls himself Mumia Abu Jamal) have made a laughing stock of our justice system.

And then along comes Governor Ryan. Geez.

More on Gov Ryan 12.Jan.2003 10:31

Bush Admirer

George Ryan?s decision to clear Illinois? death row has, as expected, sent shock waves across the United States and especially to those groups and individuals that follow the capital punishment debate.

After reading Ryan?s statement in addition to almost every response I could find regarding his decision, I?ve come up with the following conclusion which can be summarized in one word: Overrated. Before I get into that, I?d like to give a couple of thoughts on his decision.

George Ryan despises the punishment of death. He has admitted as much. As a result of that despise he turned a system with proven problems in to a totally broken system. His act is so disturbing to many not only because he embraced the proverbial throwing out the baby with the bath water attitude, but because he truly abused the office for which he was elected. A governor is the highest executive officer of a state. An executive officer?s main responsibility, actually, his ONLY official responsibility, is to execute the laws that govern that state. Ryan felt that the law, as it applied to capital punishment, could not be executed properly. Fine. He declared a moratorium to explore and study the possible miscarriages of justice that could have taken the lives of innocent individuals and in that way reaching reforms that were supposed to fix the problems. Bravo.

However, instead of exploring the issue on a case by case basis, as he was expected to do, he took the easy way out and threw the towel on the subject. George Ryan proved what many of his critics, mostly those who saw his administration as corrupted regardless of the issue of the death penalty, charged. Ryan never wanted to ?fix? the system. He wanted to completely break it so that someone else can rebuild it. Honestly, I doubt that he actually wants to see a fixed and fair capital punishment process in place. He?d rather see it as he left it, non-existent and broke. It is important to point out that when Ryan announced his moratorium plan, the basis for such was to correct its imperfections. Yet, he turned it into an escape hatch for many convicted murderers and in the process he abdicated both his official responsibilities to execute the laws as well as to make sure that those laws are in fact properly executed. The man bailed out. All in all, he turned out to be a fraud. If the system is in fact broken, as he called it, he did nothing to repair it. It'll be of little consolation for a man or a woman wrongfully convicted of murder to be sitting in a cell for the rest of their lives now that Ryan sold out the whole "fixing" process. How sad. It?ll be less consolation for the families of those that Ryan?s mercy saved to know that the murderer of their loved one will be changing lifestyles at their own expense.

Having said all that, his decision to giver collective mercy to those that deserved it as well as those who didn?t, is totally overrated in the grand picture of whether the death penalty will be viable in this country. Some pros have taken Ryan?s commutations as if it is another Furman. So have antis. I mean, the yahoo anti-DP site looked like each and every one of the participants had won the lottery. The truth is different.

First of all, Ryan?s decision is already been sharply criticized by every side of the political spectrum. Only those hardcore abolitionists have totally embraced it. However, even the in-coming democratic governor of the state has called it a mistake. Victims have made their dissatisfaction be heard quite loudly. Legislators (of both parties) are talking about revising the power of commutation given to governors in Illinois. Governors of other states have stated that the decision was ?over the top?. All in all, this total commutation decision has the looks of a total backfire. As long as the American public supports it, the death penalty is going nowhere. Period.

George Ryan gave up on a system that he wished never existed. Not difficult to do at all. However, in the overall outlook of capital punishment, his decision will be seen as a novelty, with little or no impact on every other state that does carry out the mandates of their citizens. Overstated, yes. Overrated, for sure.

> Metal Pan 12.Jan.2003 10:31

Bush Admirer

There is no evidence that any innocent person has ever been executed in the United States. None, nada, zippo, zilch.

To learn about the death penalty read this paper:
 http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

We have a criminal justice system that is wildly tilted in favor of the defendant. How else could an obviously guilty perpetrator such as OJ Simpson evade justice?

For starters the jury is instructed to presume innocence unless proven guilty by a unanimous vote of all 12 jurors. The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt 'beyond a reaonable doubt.' And we've all seen what a flim flam con man like Johnny Cochran has been able to do with 'reasonable doubt.' After conviction the defendant is entitled to seemingly endless appeals. It's comical in a sick sort of way. Depraved murderers like Wesley Cook (the jerk who calls himself Mumia Abu Jamal) have made a laughing stock of our justice system.

And then along comes Governor Ryan. Geez.

i understand perfectly what you're saying B.A 12.Jan.2003 11:25

this thing here

... you are arguing for the state of illinois to put to death possibly innocent men. in B.A.'s world, there isn't the standard of guilt known as, "beyond a reasonable doubt". in B.A.'s world, all men on death row are there because they are guilty. because they are on death row. that's the standard B.A. opperates under. "well, they wouldn't be there if they weren't guilty, right? even if they're innocent of the crimes they've been charged with, there's still probably some reason to put these men to death. it really doesn't concern me. kill 'em all, innocent or not." in B.A.'s world, the legal system of this nation, and the state of illinois, makes absolutely ZERO mistakes. "you can put all your money and your life on that", boasts B.A. that's called standing up for principles, isn't it B.A...

BA 12.Jan.2003 13:48

Sean Henderson lohan1@msn.com

After reading BA's various postings on this website over the past few months - I just have one burning question - why does he do it?

Does he really think that his style and arguments are going to change the views of the readers of this site?

Does he just like annoying us 'liberuls'?

Is he just trying to convince his own conscience of the validity of his lifestyle/attitude?

BA is a proud entrepreneur from Houston, TX that has developed various companies and sold them.

His real name is Dave Small.

This may prompt an interesting discussion to help us understand what we are up against - what composes the anatomy of a Bush Admirer?

Here on Earth 12.Jan.2003 15:32

Metal Pan

Damn, I was hoping for some intelligent discourse on this topic. I was excited to see so many comments in number but then bummed on the multiples and ludicrous arguments.

The ability of some people to be incredibly persuasive lawyers has absolutely nothing to do with someone's right to live. Just because Johnny Cochran exists doesn't mean the government should kill people. Just because OJ got off doesn't mean everyone on death row is guilty.

Juries are comprised of humans (last time I checked) and humans are often chosen to be judges. Humans err. Death is final. When a human or group of humans decides that another human must die, they are making an irreversible decision with a process that has room for error. This is not okay. This is power-tripping with other people's lives. We can never be 100% sure about anything- this is because the human is not a perfect machine. Our eyes deteriorate, our minds putrify, our perception of the outside world changes. We have no right to decide when someone should die. That is a choice they and the universe make, not a body of government.

I do believe that a murderer needs to be quarantined from society indefinitely. But this is a whole other story.

I believe that murdering the murderer is the most illogical, backwards and heinous thing our government does to its people.

we're #4 12.Jan.2003 15:40

concerned

Well, if BA had his way we'd be #1 in executions but we've got to catch up to Saudi Arabia, Iran, and China first. Who cares if 102 people have been found innocent and released from Death Row in the past 30 years? All that matters is one cannot "prove" an innocent person hasn't been executed. Well, one cannot prove it because one cannot introduce evidence into court after someone has been executed. And, of course, for some reason proponents of the death penalty don't want to allow post-execution DNA testing. You would think if they were so sure that no innocent people had been executed they'd jump at the chance to prove it and put people's minds and hearts at ease. How about it BA, would you help lobby for post-execution DNA testing (several newspapers and non-profits have offerred to pay so it won't even cost the taxpayers anything)? If you truly believe that not one innocent person has been executed why don't you work to prove it?

 http://www.web.amnesty.org/rmp/dplibrary.nsf/index?openview
 http://www.hrcberkeley.org/dna/printreport_dnadeath.html
 http://www.againstdp.org/franksmith.html

America's Biggest Serial Killer-154 Homicides 12.Jan.2003 18:29

The Texecutioner

 http://www.ccadp.org/serialpresident.htm

America's Biggest Serial Killer... 154 Homicides !
And Hundreds more attempts, with scheduled dates getting last minute stays . . .

More than any other elected official in recorded American history !

Texecution: (noun) 1.) An execution in the State of Texas;
2.) An execution with little or no hope of reprieve.
[ See also: Texecuted (verb) and Texecutioner (noun) ]

Read the poem, Kings Ancient Flaw by Jorge Cordova one of Bush's 154 victims...
 http://ccadp.org/kingsflaw.htm

KING'S ANCIENT FLAW
A poem by executed death row prisoner Jorge Cordova

DEATH BY LAW IS NOT THE SOLUTION
FOR WITHIN THE HEART BREEDS CONTEMPT AND REVOLUTION
ONE MAN KILLS, ANOTHER DIES,
WHILE THE STATE CREATES A NEST OF LIES:
"KILL HIM, KILL HER, SLAUGHTER ALL,
AND SOCIETY WILL BENEFIT OVERALL!"

THE MAN ON THE STREET LIVES HAND TO MOUTH,
IN THESE CONFEDERACY STATES OF THE SOUTH;
THE MAN IN HIS CASTLE WITH HIS BELLY FULL,
TAKES ALL HIS SUBJECTS FOR A FOOL:
"JOIN ME IN THE TRIUMPH TO SLAUGHTER THE BEAST,
AND I'LL SURELY SHOW YOU HOW TO ENJOY A FEAST!"

WITHOUT ANY POWER OR KNOWLEDGE OF WORDS,
THE PRISONER POET IS SURROUNDED BY SWORDS.
HIS CONQUERED BODY, BURIED AND SLAIN,
BUT HIS SPIRIT HE KNOWS, NO DESPOT WILL GAIN;
THO' A THOUSAND LASHES WILL BRING FORTH SORROW,
THE RESILIENT SPIRIT, ONLY THINKS ON THE MORROW.

FROM THE JAWS OF THE LION, HE'S NO STRENGTH TO RUN FREE,
AND WITH GRIP OF ITS CLAWS, ONE CAN SURELY AGREE;
WITH NO RELIEF IN THE HALLS, NO RECOURSE IN THE LAW,
BUT THE DESPOT KNOWS ONE THING, A KING'S ANCIENT FLAW:
WHEN THE PEASANTS ARE RALLIED,
WITH PITCHFORKS HELD HIGH,
TO MOUNTAINS HE'LL HARRY, WITH A FAINT AND A SIGH.

Jorge Cordova
#703 Death Row
Huntsville, Texas,
77343 USA
In Memory of Jorge Cordova:
Killed By Texas
Executed Feb. 10, 1999
Return To Jorge Cordova's Homepage
 http://ccadp.org/jorgecordova.htm

America's Biggest Serial Killer-154 Homicides
America's Biggest Serial Killer-154 Homicides

Bush Admirer 12.Jan.2003 23:09

Bush Admirer

maybe he did it on purpose. maybe it's supposed to be "news" so it will be "heavy on the minds" of the people, and effect particular people in a particular way so that a particular result might be more achievable. who knows.

memetics
 http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/MEMES.html

who do you want to control your thinking today?
 http://memes.org

Bogus post 13.Jan.2003 07:32

Bush Admirer

I don't know who posted this but it certainly wasn't me:
Bush Admirer 11:09pm Sun Jan 12 '03
comment#40769
maybe he did it on purpose. maybe it's supposed to be "news" so it will be "heavy on the minds" of the people, and effect particular people in a particular way so that a particular result might be more achievable. who knows.

memetics
 http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/MEMES.html

who do you want to control your thinking today?
 http://memes.org

who *is* 'Bush Admirer' 13.Jan.2003 14:40

Bush Admirer

are you the *real* Bush Admirer?

who really Admires Bush, anyway?

are you who you say you are, or just a 'pretend' Bush Admirer?

can you prove that you are *truly* Bush Admirer?

prove it, then--

beyond a doubt.

governor ryan no good 02.Jan.2004 09:46

jenna

Gov. Ryan, here is a message to you:

Who raised you? You disgrace the people of Illinios, and abuse the power of being in a political office. You have made me more aware of voting, however. I participate in keeping assholes like you out of office. Had I been old enough to vote back when you were being elected, I would not have voted for you. You are a criminal and deserve to be in prision on a life term. How can someone have a consience and do the things you did? Are you god? Do you think you are? Do you know how many lives you have destroyed? I wonder sometimes, what benefits HAVE you brought to the state of Illinois during your term? I cannot think of one. I feel better just knowing you are not in office anymore.