portland independent media center  
images audio video
newswire article reporting portland metro

actions & protests | human & civil rights | police / legal a22: bush protest

From the father of the pepper-sprayed children

This is an open letter describing our experience and an urgent call to action.
First and foremost I want to thank from the bottom of my heart the kind humanbeings who helped my children, my wife and me after we were pepper sprayed by the Portland Police. We were aided immediately by fellow demonstrators, the black cross and passers-by caught in the crossfire. These people shielded us with their bodies and soothed us with their treatments and words, and argued with police, putting themselves in danger, to secure our safe passage through the cordon. Their actions stand in beautiful contrast to the savage inhumanity of the police.

We brought our children to a peaceful protest, we stayed in the back and we were walking on the sidewalk. The march stopped at the intersection of 2nd and Alder we could not see why from our position on the SW corner of the intersection. Police quickly moved up behind us and a moment or two later sprayed pepper spray into the crowd from the NE corner of the intersection. the crowd ran toward us to escape the spray. We asked the oficer closest to us how we should exit the intersection. He pointed and said to exit to the NE, into the spraying police opposite him. as the crowd pressed toward us I yelled to him to let us through (south on 2nd) because we had three small children. He looked at me, and drew out his can from his hip and sprayed directly at me. I was at an angle to him and the spray hit my right eye and our three year-old who I was holding in my right arm. In the same motion he turned the can on my wife who was holding our 10 month old baby and doused both of their heads entirely from a distance of less than 3 feet. my six year old daughter was holding my left hand and was not hit directly. We ended up on the sidewalk a few feet down alder with fellow protesters holding my screaming children and and pouring water on our eyes. Someone yelled that the police had said that we could pass through the cordon on alder with the children. I picked up the baby and other protesters brought my wife and other children to the police line. We attempted to pass through but they leaned in shoulders to block us. I yelled at them to let us pass for about two minutes and finally some officer up the line nodded me and the baby through. they were not going to let my wife and other children out but after a few minutes of pleading from the crowd and another signal from up the line they let them out. As we passed the officers were laughing and said something to the effect of "thats why you shouldn't bring kids to protests".

I immediatly called 911 as we moved up to the corner of 3rd and alder. I explained that a baby had been directly pepper sprayed and that I needed an ambulance. They informed me that they would not send one and that all protesters were to report to a first aid tent on the other side of the police lines. Fellow protestors aided us until Black Cross arrived. Business people brought water from the nearby offices and someone bought some juice for the children. Two KBOO staffers drove up in their Volvo and took us to Emmanuel ER. One of the protestors who had helped us from the beginning accompanied us to the hospital and waited with us until the kids were admitted (special thanks!). The children were examined for rhespritory problems and chemical burns. Luckily all were only suffering "normal" pepper spray reactions that have no treatment but to wait. The Pediatrician kept us a little longer so that she could call poison control to check for other recomended procedures as she had never in her career seen an infant pepper spray victim.

On the way to the E.R. my three year old said that those guys back there were trying to get us and said we should call the police.


That is the story.

We need the help of every person who was at the corner of 2nd and Alder and witnessed, photographed, or made video of any of this. even if you are unable to testify later we need facts written down (location of police, names of officers, timelines, everything). we will keep it anon if you request. Two leads so far: the first officer on the line across the south side of 2nd was tagged as "Costello" the one who sprayed us would have been one, two or three to his right ( our left) also there was a very large african-american officer with a shotgun wrapped in yellow tape and wearing a yellow and black shell holder across his chest. He was in some capacity giving orders. a name would be great. Please help us expose this extreme, un-democratic, and brutal attack on peaceful citizens.


Email info to  a22brutality@attbi.com



Thank you again to all the wonderfull people who helped us. All power to the people!



Donald Joughin

Photos 24.Aug.2002 22:13

repost





i am so sorry 25.Aug.2002 00:02

peaceful protestor

thank you for sharing your heart wrenching story. it is unbelievable to me that the cop would directly spray you and your family - I am rendered speechless and feel sickened. keep telling your story, everyone needs to hear it.

thank you 25.Aug.2002 00:31

Monica

I know you must be busy with the children so thank you for taking the time and energy to work on this. If you can post news of a protest of the abuse or if/when you'll be out again, I'd appreciate it. My family will be there.

My child and I would have been standing right beside you if we hadn't been out of town that day. We have to make sure that everyone--voters, tax payers, and everyone in power--knows about this.

Back to the 60's 25.Aug.2002 06:39

John

People need to wake up. The U.S. government is going back in time. (I'm not some anti government extremist). They are using the current terrorist war to bring us back to the 50's and 60's when the police and government would respond to peaceful protests with extreme violence and take away our privacy and civil rights.
I know some cops and the comments I've heard them make have made me sick. They don't consider the protesters as human beings, they're trained to look at all of them as "the enemy", men, women and children. These idiots don't realize that they're being used by large corporations for they're own gain.
Yes, there are occassionally some people at protests who cause trouble, but those are few. Why not respond to them and not to children. How could any grown man spray pepper spray into a childs eyes? It's part of their training. They're angry because they can't do anythng about real criminals so they go after those who can't defend themselves.
TO ALL THE POLICE OUT THERE:
WE'RE NOT YOUR ENEMY. WE'RE YOUR NEIGHBORS, FAMILY AND FREINDS. YOU HAVE TO STOP HURTING PEOPLE WHO ARE PEACEFULLY PROTESTING.

I *almost* brought my kids too! 25.Aug.2002 08:05

42

I stayed home during the protests because I didn't want to leave my children ('tweenies) home alone and I didn't want to bring them with me downtown into a situation that I believed to be unpredictable, as any situation with Portland Police and a crowd of any size is inherently unpredictable. Sometimes the police stand by and watch quietly, sometimes the police fly completely off the handle and do their best to start a riot. You never know.

I've been paying attention for years, and was concerned about my kids' safety, as well as my own ability to escape if I had to simultaneously be concerned about my children. So I stayed home, despite assurances from many friends that this would be a peaceful protest and that Portland police had learned their lesson in the fallout from the May Day melee in 2000.

I do not point all this out to berate the parents who did feel safe bringing their children to the protest, but rather to point out that it was only my extreme paranoia that prevented me from doing the same thing. This was a peaceful protest! The "parent" chiding and insulting this man above is wrong! There was no reasonable reason to not make this a family event. There was no rational reason to expect that what happened would happen. To imply that this family deserved what it got by virtue of its own stupidity, is coarse, harsh, and feeding into the hardened, inhumane arguments of the right wing. Even if bringing children was not the best judgement call, to say that their presence made them a legitimate target is reprehensible in the extreme, and does not succeed in excusing the behavior of the Portland stormtroopers.

- 42 -

911 Rejection Needs to be Examined!! 25.Aug.2002 08:52

oaklander

911 can NOT tell protestors to get 'taken care of' at the scene - even that doctor admitted she had never seen a child so small get sprayed and so wanted to keep a watch. That shows that the 911 operator could not have known the exact safety of that child and put your family at risk by rejecting you.

Was Black Cross coordinating with 911 and local hospitals? If not, problem - 911 can't just tell people to go elsewhere.

I also was listening to the police scanner and they were saying that they hoped people would just get help at their local hospitals - come on! If the cops, 911, and the hospitals are NOT COORDINATED we've got a big problem!

Please someone follow up on this - we can't have protestors getting rejected by 911 operators. That implies that people at protests don't desrve medical treatment because of the event they are at. That's insane. Do hospitals not send ambulances to sports stadiums if there are riots? Or to any other large events with potential for harm??

Concerned Parents 25.Aug.2002 09:12

Another Parent

The account of the event with the police and this parent seems to be designed to elicit emotions against the police. Having not been there it's hard for me to accurately assess the actions of anyone who was. Putting myself in place of some of these officers, I can see how emotions run high and things you don't intend to happen, take place. In most cases, I am willing to bet the police officers involved with this type of action would probably rather be somewhere else. This parent did choose to be there. With his children. I mean no personal disrespect but....What - is he stupid? Does he not have television or read newspapers? Does he not know how many of these events unfold? Is this type of event the proper place to bring someone so young? I recognize he has the right to do so. He also has to bear the responsibility of his actions when he does. Personally, pitting myself against a fully dressed, combat ready police force does not seem smart. Using the results of my actions to incite more emotions keeps the 'us and them' mentality going.

It does seem to me that people should not bring their young children to the front lines of any protest - allegedly peaceful or not. When I see the pictures of the father and his child, it occurs to me that the father, not the police, allowed this to happen. This would be akin to taking your child to watch a lava flow. We know it's not really safe. My daughter has never been sprayed with pepper spray. I would never put her in a circumstance where this could happen. Especially at such a young age where she would have no idea what was going on and would have no intelligent contribution to make to the event. If she chooses to go when she's old enough to make that choice, she has that right.

Having said that, I am not defending the actions of the police. As I said, I was not there. I do, however, read the paper and see the television accounts of these events. Because of that I recognize the power and force the police have and use in these situations. That well-known fact alone would be enough for me to know I may not be completely safe there - let alone my young children. As a parent, my job is to care for my children and keep them harm's way. That is my responsibility.

I am truly sorry about what happened with this child. The parents need to be more responsible and keep their children out of harm's way - no matter what it takes to accomplish that. In this context, children don't have the 'right' to be there to protest. They are, by definition, not protesting. Quite simply, they are too young. If anything, the kids would be protesting their parents' actions. Parents have responsibilities that are greater than their right to civil expression. As far as I am concerned, one should act on your child's rights first and your right to protest second.

In the meantime, the police should answer for their responsibilities too.

Sue the bastards! 25.Aug.2002 09:14

Socialist

Please sue the City of Portland. Everyone who can, please provide information to  a22brutality@attbi.com. It is also true that the emergency system, 911, acted contrary to the law in refusing to help. This case is worth a fortune. I am sure every plaintiff's attorney in Portland will be glad to take this case. Children have a right, and in my opinion, a duty, to attend demonstrations. I have been attending demonstrations since the day I was born, over 50 years ago, and never experienced police brutality. Demonstrations are a First Amendment activity; that is we have a right to freedom of assembly, free speech and a right to petition for redress of grievances. This is not a return to the 1950s and 1960s; it is an advance to fascism. Pepper spray is potentially lethal at close range and there is no reason for any police department to have any pepper spray whatsoever. This is the latest horror perpetrated by Nazi USA.

Parent's Responsbilities - one opinion 25.Aug.2002 09:25

Concerned Parents

The account of the event with the police and this parent seems to be designed to elicit emotions against the police. Having not been there it's hard for me to accurately assess the actions of anyone who was. Putting myself in place of some of these officers, I can see how emotions run high and things you don't intend to happen, take place. I doubt that most officers would make a target of a child. In most cases, I am willing to bet the police officers involved with this type of action would probably rather be somewhere else. This parent did choose to be there. With his children. Does he not have television or read newspapers? Does he not know how many of these events unfold? Is this type of event the proper place to bring someone so young? I recognize he has the right to do so. He also has to bear the responsibility of his actions when he does. Personally, pitting myself against a fully dressed, combat ready police force does not seem smart. Using the results of my actions to incite more emotions keeps the 'us and them' mentality going.

It does seem to me that people should not bring their young children to the front lines of any protest - allegedly peaceful or not. When I see the pictures of the father and his child, it occurs to me that the father, not the police, allowed this to happen. This would be akin to taking your child to watch a lava flow. We know it's not really safe. My daughter has never been sprayed with pepper spray. I would never put her in a circumstance where this could happen. Especially at such a young age where she would have no idea what was going on and would have no intelligent contribution to make to the event. If she chooses to go when she's old enough to make that choice, she has that right.

Having said that, I am not defending the actions of the police. As I said, I was not there. I do, however, read the paper and see the television accounts of these events. Because of that I recognize the power and force the police have and use in these situations. That well-known fact alone would be enough for me to know I may not be completely safe there - let alone my young children. As a parent, my job is to care for my children and keep them harm's way. That is my responsibility.

I am truly sorry about what happened with this child. The parents need to be more responsible and keep their children out of harm's way - no matter what it takes to accomplish that. In this context, children don't have the 'right' to be there to protest. They are, by definition, not protesting. Quite simply, they are too young. If anything, the kids would be protesting their parents' actions. Parents have responsibilities that are greater than their right to civil expression. As far as I am concerned, one should act on your child's rights first and your right to protest second.

In the meantime, the police should answer for their responsibilities too.

Please 25.Aug.2002 10:03

Outraged

Read The Constitution. In it American citizens are guaranteed free speech, the right to assemble, and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances. Our government and those who are paid out of the pockets of the people are here to PROTECT and DEFEND the citizens of the U.S., not to harm and suppress them. At my next protest, I will be bringing a copy of The Constitution in order to remind the police of our rights.

Only right-wing, anti-American facist nazi's have a problem with dissenting opinions. Well thought-out dissenting opinions are one thing--anyone has a right to disagree with the message of the protestors, but what we get from the right is mindless stupidity, ditto-speak, attack and hate-filled slurs.

Some on the right say the protest movement is dying. I say this is only the beginning as there is a vast silent majority out there waiting to take to the streets and show the elitist, facist regime in D.C. we will not tolerate the subversion of our basic human rights.

The larger picture, please 25.Aug.2002 11:33

Ken Aldrich aldri7@earthlink.net

I feel symapthetic towards the children who were pepper sprayed, but I also concur with those asking why young children were brought to the protest. I don't believe the Portland police are generally brutal, unhuman, "Rambo" males who enjoy causing suffering. And I also know that at least some protesters at these events specifically go because they enjoy taunting and swearing at police. Of course, I'm not refering to the family in question here - they just got caught in the crossfire unfortunately.

Which brings me to my main point, and that is that all of this distracts from the main issues which involve Bush and the curtailment of civil liberties etc. What should follow from a day of protest is a discussion of these issues on this website rather than what the police did or didn't do. So its unfortunate that the big picture keeps getting obscured. Nowhere in the above post is any mention made of Bush and Co. The man gets away scot free while the police take the brunt of our anger. So I'm angry too in a sense because I see this happening all the time. Who's the bigger villain - the police or those in the White House? Bush's presidency is fostering increased violence all over the world. Now it has been brought home to us exactly what we are up against. So prepare yourself for some rough times ahead, stay focused on the main issues and leave the kids at home next time.

Ken, your privilege is showing 25.Aug.2002 11:47

Monica

How shall I leave my kids at home? They're not old enough to stay alone and I can't afford a babysitter. Or were you only talking to those parents able to AFFORD to protest? If that's a Constitutional amendment, I missed it: the right to gather and protest...if you can afford to take the day off, hire a babysitter, and are able-bodied.
Stop blaming the victims and turn your energy on what went WRONG and what we're going to do about it.

Gosh, 25.Aug.2002 12:16

here's an Idea

We should just have disabled and parents with small children in the front lines.

Some seriously stupid posts here 25.Aug.2002 12:42

a parent too

There are some seriously stupid posts here.

For example, from 'another parent'"Personally, pitting myself against a fully dressed, combat ready police force does not seem smart"

You are a manipulative asshole - the father did not 'pit' himself against anybody

" It does seem to me that people should not bring their young children to the front lines of any protest - allegedly peaceful or not"

The father stated quite clearly he was nowhere near the front line - again you are being a manipulative asshole

" Having said that, I am not defending the actions of the police. As I said, I was not there. I do, however, read the paper and see the television accounts of these events. Because of that I recognize the power and force the police have and use in these situations"

You most certainly are defending the actions of the police. Because you read the paper and watch the TV you are brainwashed. You were not there, so you do not know anything about it, but the lies that were told on the TV. You have no basis for the bullshit you are spewing here.

You should be ashamed of yourself for trying to blame the father for the brutal violence of the cops. You disgust me. The cops knowingly attacked, and without good reason, a family with small children.

You lack of concern for people's fundamental rights being so crudely violated shows you to be a callous and brainwashed idiot. Your words mean nothing. WAKE UP!

typical responses from priviledged people 25.Aug.2002 12:44

fed up with priviledge

You people who are trying to blame the victim make me sick!

Bleck!!

Typical response from priviledged white people - Side with the power structure, and blame the victim

You need a spankin!

What is the real issue here? 25.Aug.2002 13:01

time4change

One of the tactics of the Powers that Be are to divide the dissenters so as to disempower the strength of our movement. The people united will never be defeated. Debating about whether or not it is safe to bring your children to a protest is wasting time on one of the symptoms of the disease rather than focusing on the disease itself. Our energies should instead be focused on the fact that it isn't safe to bring our children to protest. We need to bring this questionn to the mainstream - who in fact are the police protecting? Obviously not the public. An incident such as this needs to be capitalized on (excuse the term) because it highlights the extreme contradictions in our capitalist society - spraying a ten-month old and three year old is maintaining the peace. If we can't stop arguing about who is a responsible parent and who is not rather then fact that a protest in a "free" country should never reach that point to begin with, how do we expect the everyday CNN watching person to go beyond the republican-or-democrat paradigm to question the ultimate goal of the imperialistic structure of our capitalist government?
Lets use our intelligence and passion and energies to reveal the real issue - what causes one human being in a uniform feel it is right to cause harm to the citizens that they are supposed to serve and protect, regardless of their age or vulnerability, and share this debate with the growing number of fencesitters.
Lets not let them divide us all.

Re: GOSH and Monica.... 25.Aug.2002 13:22

Ken Aldrich aldri7@earthlink.net

The people in the front lines should be fully knowledgable about the dangers and risks associated with street protests. When cops show up wearing full riot gear, a little light bulb should go off in your head saying "they are not going to a picnic". I'm not blaming the family in question here, because, if I recall, they weren't at the front lines. But lets not put vulnerable people in front just so that we can blame cops for attacking innocents. Put yourself at risk instead. Be prepared to accept the consequences that you know from experience might occur. Then when they occur, you can have the satisfaction of knowing that you sacrificed yourself so that your message could be heard. But those children could never have that satifaction because they were too young to know what was happening. For that reason, I questioned why they were there in the first place. If you can't hire a baby sitter, at least be aware that you are putting them at some risk, and try to restrain yourself from labeling cops as "baby attackers" which will only inflame them further and make future violence more likely

Blaming the victim is cruel 25.Aug.2002 13:41

Liberate the kids

Hey Concerned Parent:
Blaming the victim makes you an asshole. Yes protests sometimes escalate into riots. Yes, I'm sure the parent knew this. Protest organizers had specifically put out a communique stating that there would be a "Family Zone", so people were encouraged to bring their kids. No, it's not wise to have kids near the front line. That still doesn't change the fact that the copper conciously made the decision to do what he did.
Look, the bottom line is this: the police knowingly pepper sprayed a little kid. That cop has eyes. He saw had to look at the kid to aim to his pepper spray. Even if you're such a freedom-loathing individual so as to think that it's ok for the police to physically attack crowds of people, there's simply no excuse for not taking a second actually look and see who you're firing chemical weapons at.
Protests are not always safe. Neither is driving a car. Nobody ever scolds parents for putting their kids in cars, even though cars are really goddamn dangerous and kill kids all the time.
Your post seems awfully apologetic about police behavior. You make all kinds excuses for the ones who wielded the pepper spray (they were scared, they didn't mean it) and then place the blame on the person who got pepper spray. Your statement saying the police should be responsible for their actions seems like an afterthought. You seem to think that: it was all a big mistake, the police aren't really that bad, we just need to stop thinking it's "us versus them" and make friends with the cops. Put flowers in their gun barrels, it'll make everything better. YOU ARE IDENTIFYING WITH AND ENABLING YOUR OPPRESSORS. You seem to think it's insane to resist the police state when it's in reality it's insane not to (if we don't resist it, it'll only get worse and worse).
Did it ever occur to you that the original post "elicits emotions against the police" because the police are psychotic nazi pigs? That there can be no dialouge with people who use force to take what they want?
Do you live in a neighborhood where the police only come when you call them? Are you white and financially secure? I'm guess the answers are yes, because if you lived somewhere like, say, Northeast where police terrorism is a part of everyday life then you wouldn't be saying such stupid things, and siding with the people who use armed force to defend your privelege at other's expense.
Which side are you on?

This is the real issue! 25.Aug.2002 13:56

Bill

Police brutality certainly is a real issue. When an instance so egregious as this one is captured on film and witnessed by hundreds, we definitely need to make a lot of noise about it. These situations give us a precious opportunity to expose the brutal system for what it is and show the people of this country who the real terrorists are. This is not a distraction, it is the real issue!

Police Assault on Citizens 25.Aug.2002 15:16

Bhodidharma thenewbhodidharma@yahoo.com

In a land where our freedom of speech, assembly, and liberty are supposed to be the most protected of our freedoms, we have those freedoms most often tread upon by those paid to protect them. Acts like this pepper spraying of a peaceful protest group are why the Police can't feel safe. They know that there are few out here who have not had their rights violated by the police at one time or another. They respond with fear to a crowd because they can't see who will attack them. They attack the weakest persons they can because they are truly cowards. If they were to attack anyone formidable they just might get hurt. Their tactics are self defeating but they fail to see that. These children who were attacked will grow up distrusting and possibly hating police as a result of their abuse. If one day one of these children should strike down a policeman that would be karma. That it is karma will not spare the child from facing the direst of consequences. There in lies the problem. The police are not held accountable for their actions. A police officer or any Government official that violates one of the laws he has sworn an oath to uphold should be held to the strictest penalty allowed. Not only have they commited a crime, but in so doing have violated their oath and the commision of their office that we, the people, have been paying them in good faith to keep. When an officer is slain we are supposed to feel bad for them. Why? When Osama bin laden attacked the US, our Government Attacked the people of Affghanistan. Did we feel bad for killing the Taliban? NO. They reaped what they sowed. If the police officers who are worth a damn would arrest and weed out the abusive and corrupt within their ranks instead of covering up for them they would notice they have nothing to fear from the public. Until they police themselves there are no "good" cops. They all know who amongst them are the Corrupt and abusive, to let them remain on the force makes them accomplices, and thereby equally guilty. I would weep no more for a slain officer than a slain mullah.

Who polices the police? 25.Aug.2002 16:12

bulletinman bulletinman@hotmail.com

Just who is minding the store? If they sprayed my 10 month old daughter I would have to fight back with everything I had. I will defend my family with deadly force if the need arises. Amerika is on the verge of a police state. These terrorist must be held accountable.

618-939-4916

I am disgusted 25.Aug.2002 16:29

Ani animare@excite.com

I am so sorry to hear about what happened to your baby. I am disgusted to know that I live in a country where our police feel it's okay to assault peaceful protests.

As, for all of the victim blaming going on here.. Wow. Yuck. Have you all forgotten that Martin Luther Kind felt that children had a central place in the civil rights movement? Children marched, children resisted, and sadly children died. Martin Luther King believed that children had rights and a soul that needed to be taught about resistance as a form of spiritual teaching.

Blessings to your family,
Ani

What is the issue is here 25.Aug.2002 16:46

greyteyes

The parents, Good or bad, right or wrong in bring their children to a peaceful march is NOT the issue. So far, but just barely it's still a free country. I can't imagine how guilty the parents must feel after this sickening display and the grossly abusive acts by the Portland police dept. aimed directly at their innocent children. In hindsight I'm sure they wish they left the kids at home and maybe next time they will. I'm sure Mom and Dad are beating themselves up far worse than anyone else could. Again THE ISSUE IS the blatant abuse by the police to it's own citizens!

IMHO anybody that refuses to focus on the stated facts and blame the victims should re-examine their priorities and compassion levels. The fact is the PPD DELIBERATLY AND INTENTIONALY AND WITH MALICE PEPPER SPRAYED A 10 MONTH OLD BABY IN THE FACE. Assuming the cop(s) are fully capable of cognitive, sane and rational thinking, then their actions become and are totally INTENTIONAL & UN-EXCUSABLE. PERIOD! If this cruel and sick event does not anger and enrage you or at the very least make one feel some compassion for that baby, then maybe you should ask yourself 'What WILL it take?' WHAT?

Perhaps this will be the "vehicle" we've needed to finally bring to light what's really going on in the USA. I can't see how even the corporate media can ignore this.

Could you ever in your wildest nightmares have thought it possible that police anywhere in the United States of AMERICA at anytime, would intentionally target, take aim and then pepper spray babies and children in their faces? From three feet away? I never thought so. Think about that!
My heartfelt best wishes go out to this AMERICAN FAMILY.

Canadian Father 25.Aug.2002 17:03

Tom Krundle

I am a Father of two and have brouhgt my family to maney protests in Canada. Mostly in Victoria and Calgary. Victoria happens to be the most scoially active city in western Canada. Our police help us by stopping traffic and making sure the way is clear as we march to the parliament building. Once at the parliament we are met by no berricads, no riot clad police and no pepper sprey.

Sounds kind of dull, I know . As we chant and call for social justice the parliament building does nothing, sometimes we wish there was someone to here are call. We never make the news, until we held a rally of over 50,000 people. It just so happend that the fire department and the police were part of that rally. Guess what, no violence and every body brouhgt there kids.

Now, sounds to me like your living in a fascist state, where protest is met with pepper sprey and rubber bullets. The only time I have seen these kind of actions by the police, in my country, is when there is a WTO Meeting or Bush comes for a visit. Seems to me these are deliberate tactics to scare you from legitimate protest(Non Violent). Sounds like its working, You have people like "concerned parents" cowering in her home reading and watching TV as it spuse out its latest so called report on reality. My advice to here is turn the TV off, and take a look outside. What you will see are people fighting for your rights. In the future the people that went to the front lines to fight for true freedom will be seen for what they are..heros. The courage to step out of the masses and raise a decenting voice for freedom, truth, and real justice, against the rising tid of oppresion, shall be haild as one of the greatest deeds mankind has seen since the civil rights movement.

You need to step out and step up for your time is running out. Can you drink the water and know it is truly safe. Can you breath the air and say it is fresh. Can you eat the food without thinking it is contaminated. Are the clothes on your back made fairly, or are they made by children. How old are those nuclear reactors getting? Are they safe? Oh yeah, you have the biggest and most expensive millitary complex in the world, tell me, do you feel safe?

Cops, steroids and rage 25.Aug.2002 18:23

Diogenes

Cops are known to abuse steroids and HGH in order to get an "edge" on the criminal element.

One of the more obvious side effects is a marked shortening of temper -- the infamous "'roid rage" we often hear about.

I wouldn't be surprised to hear the cop who pepper-sprayed a non-violent protester and his children was in fact in the throes of 'roid rage.

(Oh, yes: Steroids kill you if you take them long enough.)

So sorry for your experience with the police 25.Aug.2002 18:46

Chessy

I really feel for you and your children. You had every right to bring your children to a peaceful protest. No doubt you believed that as a citizen of the once great country, you would be allowed to peacefully express your opinion.

Our country needs people to speak out for peace, civil rights, tolerance, and the environment. I applaud your courage but I am not surprised at the reaction you encountered from the police.

I grew up during the civil rights movement and the anti-war movement. Unfortunately, I witnessed and experienced what you and your family went through. I have seen college students and other protesters dragged into the bushes and beat within an inch of their lives by policemen with tape over their badge numbers.

Waking up to what is really happening can be cruel.

Ignorant troll 25.Aug.2002 19:00

DNFTEC

Ignore the troll who blames the victim. His accusations against "typical liberals" are nothing but projections of his own insecurities and limitations.

Opportunity to tell your story on the Radio 25.Aug.2002 19:42

Joe Jackson joejacksonlive@yahoo.com

I am sadden but sit here with rage as I browse through the pictures of an apparent police state. I am extending you the opportunity to be on my radio show. I am Joe Jackson, Utah's only Liberal talk radio host. My show is early morning drivetime, 5-7am mountain time...4-6am pacific. It would be an honor for me to have Don and his family as well as any of you who found the need to express your constitutional right to protest. I would like you to tell the seemingly forever sleeping sheep in Utah who apparently remove themselves from the rest of the world, your story. We need to wake this country up and you have taken the first step. I have guests scheduled all week, but I will bump them all if any of you would like to come on air and give us a first hand account.

Just respond by email and I will get right back to you to  confirm.......joejacksonlive@yahoo.com...................
KTKK, K Talk 630AM, Salt Lake City, Utah.

I thank all of you for standing up to what has become a serious threat to our freedoms.

Keep the faith, you are to be commended. We should be celebrating you!!

Joe Jackson

Who asked the child? 25.Aug.2002 20:01

Wondering

Seems to me the child didn't have a choice in whether to be there or not.

better question 25.Aug.2002 20:38

witness

Who gave the order or authority for the Police Officer to fire chemical weapons on women and children?

Typical conservative 25.Aug.2002 23:40

Liberate the kids (FascistsRScum)

Hey LibsRScum, do you beat your kids? Do you believe that violence is always the correct way to deal with "uppity" people? Have you ever really experienced the emotion known as "compassion"? Ever? Were you abused as a child yourself? Why do you think its wrong to blame the state for actions carried out by the state? You've got some issues buddy, and the sooner you honestly deal with them the happier you and everyone who has to interact with you will be.

Also, I just want to say that upon re-reading Concerned Parent's post, this statement really stuck out: "Using the results of my actions to incite MORE EMOTIONS (emphasis added) keeps the 'us and them' mentality going"
Do you have problems expressing emotions? Do you think that there's something wrong with expressing emotions? Does the thought of letting yourself get really upset scare you? Are you currently taking any pharmacutical anti-depressants? Do you think that suppressing emotions is a healthy way of being?

We live in a culture of permitted violence and coercion directed toward children. I don't have any domestic violence statistics to quote off the top of my head, but I know for a fact that child abuse is VERY widespread. It (domestic violence) probably increased in frequency after Sept 11, considering how much neurosis came to the surface in this country in all the other arenas of social life: ie denial-based flag waving, racist attacks on Arabs, public consent for increased state repression, increased affinity with vicious, cruel father figures, be it the Judeo-Christian's vengeful God (as in "God Bless America") who maketh us to worship implements of torture and execution(the cross) or George Bush (who is, according to the apocalyptic fundamentalist cosmology that he himself promulgates, taking orders from God). The patriarchal nuclear family, religious instituions, and the school system use violence and authoritarianism to suppress the child's innate curiosity, creativity, playfulness, and sexuality. Those who resist are punished. Child abuse lies at the root of the psychological rigidity and character armoring that leads to boys growing up to be more willing to go to a foriegn country and kill total strangers (or pepper spray babies) than to kiss another boy. What happened on the streets on Thursday is just an extreme manifestion of what happens every day in homes across Amerikkka. Wilhelm Reich had his books burned in nazi germany (which he was forced to flee) and in the u.s. (where he died in prison) for pointing these sorts of things out. I suggest that you read them, concerned parent and LibsRScum, if you have any interest in really understanding what's going on around you. I dare you, even if it's just for the sake of being able to better refute my arguments. "listen, little man" and "The Mass Psychology of Fascism" are both very good. Derrick Jensen's "A Language Older than Words" and "A culture of make-believe" are also highly recommended.
One more thing, concerned parent: hiding from or justifying tyranny will not make it go away. Resistance is a process through which we reclaim the power and joy that have been stolen from us. I was on the streets last Thursday and despite all the police violence I witnessed, I feel less afraid now, because we collectively confronted the state's seemingly monolithic authority and exposed it for the shallow fraud that it is. Just like the big scary fiery talking head in the Wizard of Oz, it really is just a timid, frightened little man (or little men actually, and a few little women) behind the curtain.

kids do belong at protests 25.Aug.2002 23:51

Andy

Kids do belong at protests, with the GOP screwin our schools so bad it needs to be shown that kids will not tolerate the terrible lack of education dollars. I am 14 and I would like to thank you for bring your kids to the protest. Protests shouldnt be limited to 20-30 year olds, anyone and everyone has a reason should come.

kids do belong at protests 25.Aug.2002 23:51

Andy

Kids do belong at protests, with the GOP screwin our schools so bad it needs to be shown that kids will not tolerate the terrible lack of education dollars. I am 14 and I would like to thank you for bring your kids to the protest. Protests shouldnt be limited to 20-30 year olds, anyone and everyone has a reason should come.

We Should Remember 26.Aug.2002 00:31

karlof1

We should remember that our government has deliberately targeted and killed millions of children worldwide since WW2, so it should really not be a surprise that the "security forces" of the elite follow the same policy here. If the children were mine, the cop's action would constitue an immediate declaration of war and would have suffered the consequences for his actions. I know that sentiment is not what many here would like to read, but we are now engaged in a "low-intensity war" for our rights as citizens (and actually have been for a long time now).

The parents and all the demonstrators attacked by the PPD need to file Criminal charges against those responsible for the police riot instead of civil lawsuits that seek monetary damages because any monies rewarded are ultimately paid by those same assaulted citizens through their taxes and don't result in the purging of the PPD that is so clearly needed.

Furthermore, a well written, detailed account of the whole action should be submitted to the Oregonian (which apparantly has no clue nor had any reporter present), Commondreams.org, The Nation, and other "progressive" publications to provide a counterweight to the corporate media's blatant faslifications of the event, and this account should be cross-posted to every Indymedia site worldwide.

In many respects, the action in Portland has the potential to be seen as the opening salvo in the campaign to destroy the Bu$h regime, delegitimize the corporate media and usurp the elite which both serve.

Second time in 3 years 26.Aug.2002 07:40

Sharon riordanks@earthlink.net

This is the second time in three years that I have witnessed these atrocities from the State of Washington, since moving home in 1999.
After living in Malaysia for several years, and witnessing the water cannons control the masses of people who were demonstrating there against the PM., I could not wait to return "Home".
I see the same thing happening here, and I am horrified.
Tell me why the city of Portland Oregon can gather so many individuals willing to risk their lives for a right cause, and the rest of us just sit in dumbfounded amazement?
A nation paralyzed with fear and disbelief?
Children sprayed with pepper spray, rubber bullets?
What next?
This is not TIANANMEN SQUARE.
Is it????

Message from UK 26.Aug.2002 07:41

Rupert Herries rherries@hotmail.com

My nephue forwarded the info and photo's regarding the recent anti Bush demontrations in USA. I am mystified that something like this can happen, yet over here we do not get to hear any thing about it! Many people in the UK have the impression that most American people are going along with all the terrifying policies of the present administration. If these recent riots were more widely known about over here it would strengthen the argument held by the majority of British people against Blair's support of this Bush regime.These demonstrators have given me a lift..over here we are feeling helpless and deeply worried.

Niven's Laws 26.Aug.2002 08:57

LN LN@LN.COM

1a) Never throw shit at an armed man.
1b) Never stand next to someone who is throwing shit at an armed man.

The RIGHT FOR PEACEFUL PROTEST 26.Aug.2002 08:58

d. crinnion ninlil2@yahoo.com

we must all fight for the right of peaceful protest.. we can not sit by silent while the police become nazi thugs.. evidently we can not expect these men who hide in battle form and face hidden to behave as human beings.. they have lost all decency,,,,

Peace cops Suck! 26.Aug.2002 10:59

Heckno

Peace cops you suck! Next time I see you bossing some parent around, helping the cops arrest militants, screaming repeat after me, or otherwise bieng a dominant pig I'm gonna call you on it. People Need to do what they believe is right. If you got a problem with them outline it. But if you believe that Anarchists are gonna let you or csd take thier kids for expressing dissent your dead wrong.

Kids would be safe if cops weren't there 26.Aug.2002 12:42

river city girl

After reading those who align themselves with cops who pepperspray small children, it is easy to see that they are the ones engaging in the 'blame the victim' game.

It's scary how blind and so deep in denial some people are about police brutality and misconduct that even when children and babies are victims, they stick their heads deeper in the sand, and repeat the mantra, the kids had no right to be there, and the cops were right to feel threatened by babies enough to use force against them.

If this father wants to hold people esp. those in government accountable for what they did to his children, more power to him. If someone did that to my kids, you better believe I would do what it took to hold those accountable who hurt my child.

Police not thinking this through 26.Aug.2002 13:25

Tony pdxbikerboy@hotmail.com

It seems that the cops aren't quite thinking this through. If they were really concerned with maintaining order, then they should encourage people to bring their children. The more children at these protests, the less likely the crowd will be to act out (which really wasn't even the case this time).

The more dangerous the cops make these protests, then the more likely they are to be populated by younger, more fiery protesters with nothing to lose. These tactics will only make these events worse.

As to the the "parent" who wrote the "Duh" response. This world is not a spectator sport and this is allegedly a participatory democracy. Caring about this world and society, and learning to speak out about it is something that must be passed on to future generations. As to date there is no interactive CD where kids can learn about democracy from the comfort of their own homes.

Should parents wait til their kids are 18? And then only strong stocky kids? Take only boys? Who wins here?

If we all responded to these events by seeking safety, then we would handing the reins over to the cops. Do we surrender the streets when someone gets mugged? Then why should it matter when it's the cops doing the mugging?

To the parents I say thank you for taking part.

Think about who joins the police 26.Aug.2002 14:28

Mike tv315@aol.com

Think about who becomes a cop. In general, dumb guys who think pushing people around makes them worthwhile human beings.. They're poorly educated, think with their muscles, and get off on power. Arguing with a cop is about as useful as arguing with a rock.

There are some good cops, but it's safe to say that in general, the police deparment attacts the worst kind of people to its ranks. Too often, the only difference between a cop and a criminal thug is the uniform and badge.

So that's it then? 26.Aug.2002 15:13

Bout Time

We've fallen to the 'watch what you say - watch where you go - watch what you do' Fascist state? From what I've seen of videos/photos on the protest, this was a peaceful pascifist protest; something still very legal in this country. I'm in NYC and sice I saw this in my morning email & info traul, it has consumed me with the same feeling I had on 9/11/01. Only thing diffrent: I feel a blood lust whenever I see a child harmed.
I still wear my buzzcut from the military portion of my life, am a dyed in the wool capitalist, and wanted to vote for John McCain before the Bush cabal stole the nomination from him, so voted Gore as the next best thing....so this show it's clearly not a Hippie issue, or a parent issue, but an American issue of military force being used on the citizen population; that it was the children and elderly amplifies the transgression.
American aren't cattle; stop acting like it!

Pepper Spray 26.Aug.2002 15:27

J in Orlando jahreha@webtv.net

I participated in a Anti Cheney demonstration in Orlando over a week ago...when he was here for the fundraiser for FEney for congress. Although we had a permit to demonstrate...we were made to go FAR Away from where Cheney would enter the building...rather than get arrested...we complied...and never got to demonstrate...but actually it WORKED in our favor...as after HE LEFT...with all those BODY GUARDS...and SECRET SERVICE and SHARP SHOOTERS>>>we approached the front of the HOTEL where the fundraiser was...and all the TV cameras and reporters....and lo and behold...we were then INTERVIEWED by all the PRESS....by that time...there were only THREE OF US left ....and we GAVE OUR STORY TO THE PRESS>..consiquently.......CHEney got 30 seconds on TV yaking about his great? candidate...WE WERE ON TV...THE CONTINUOUS 24 HOUR NEWS ALL THE TIME CHANNEL...ALL DAY LONG...WE HAD A BIGGER IMPACT BY COMPLIING WITH THE POLICE....AND GETTING FULL PRESS COVERAGE OF OUR VIEWS...OUR SIGNS...ETC...SO ALTHOUGH WE DIDNT BOTHER CHENEY...WE SURE GOT THE MESSAGE OUT...SOMe of my signs said....9/11...you KNEW.....Nov 2000 THE STOLEN ELECTION....Bush + CHENEy + GREED + OIL = WAR ALSO.......ECONOMY DOWN...ECOLOGY DOWN...UNEMPLOYMENT UP FEBERAL DEBT UP...using arrows to denote the up and down....afterward...many of the Orlando police said THAnks ...Keep demonstrating...we are on your side...so....be careful....but realize....the press and police can be on your side....because AFTER BUsh or Cheney LEAVE the premises...you will be interviewed....and you CAN GET THE WORD OUT>>.Oh another thing...many people driving passed us...gave us the finger and yelled obsenities...but there were MANY MORE WHO CHEERED US AND GAVE US THUMBS UP...DEMONSTRATE...BUT BE CAREFUL...BUT BELIEVE ME...the Press will be on your side...IF YOU CAN GET TO THEM>>>AFTER THE OPPRESSORS LEAVE

In response to those who cry " bad parents!" 26.Aug.2002 15:57

Dave

To all those who have blamed the victims in this case: shame on you! Citizens have a right to attend public events. If a left wing group attacked an American Legion parade and pepper sprayed small children in attendance, would you say that the parents of the small children were at fault? If they were at a soccer game that got out of hand and the police responded by pepper spraying a crowd at random, would you suggest that they had no business being there?

We're with you - TIME TO FIGHT 26.Aug.2002 16:29

William W. livinginthepast@mindspring.com

I am so sorry about what happened to you and your family. This is absolutely outrageous. Doing this to an adult is one thing, but to harm a baby and children? I am angry beyond words. What? Did the baby and children provide a security risk for that AWOL, spoiled rich boy coward GEORGE W BUSH?

We all need to come together and bring down the BUSH CRIME FAMILY FASCISTS who promote and validate this kind of response to dissent.

My father was right, THE POLICE ARE PRIMARILY THE STRONG ARMS OF THE RICH AND POWERFUL.

We're with you - TIME TO FIGHT 26.Aug.2002 16:42

William W. livinginthepast@mindspring.com

I am so sorry about what happened to you and your family. This is absolutely outrageous. Doing this to an adult is one thing, but to harm a baby and children? I am angry beyond words. What? Did the baby and children provide a security risk for that AWOL, spoiled rich boy coward GEORGE W BUSH?

We all need to come together and bring down the BUSH CRIME FAMILY FASCISTS who promote and validate this kind of response to dissent.

My father was right, THE POLICE ARE PRIMARILY THE STRONG ARMS OF THE RICH AND POWERFUL.

To posters saying "Don't bring kids to protes 26.Aug.2002 17:02

Michael Sosnick

I wish to say this to the people who are putting forth the posts that people shouldn't bring their kids to a protest.

I agree. I mean, how many times do you hear of the militant anti-choicers' kids getting hit with pepper spray? If they ever were, you would bet that those people would be screaming bloody murder at the top of the so-called "liberal press"'s lungs. Yet, they put their kids on the front lines every time, and the kid has no idea what mommy and daddy are doing.

Pro-choicers do not order pepper-spraying of children, and most pro-choicers probably choose life anyway. The point is that there still is a choice.

THE POLICE 26.Aug.2002 17:02

Alejandro

That story is unbelievable but yet it is true. I first heard about the protest from my local public radio station and a went on the web to read more. Well, being the conditioned pawn that I can be i went to CNN.com which gave no mention to the pepper spray incident but did say some pepper spray was used to "Calm" the angry crowd. All i can say is: GEE ISNT IT GREAT TO LIVE IN AMERIKKKA.
peace be with you fellow comrades

Well, how about that? 26.Aug.2002 17:28

Democrata

Since every other major protest since the moron-n-thief has taken over has been tightly controlled and isolated by the police and the secret service, how can anyone really blame the parents for not knowing that it was going to evolve into a rubber bullet pepperspray slugfest?

Regardless...
The police should take extra caution in making sure that nobody is hurt, man, woman or child while exercising their constitutional rights. Afterall, are we just really supposed to sit in our homes until things calm down? You know, right afterall martial law is fully implemented and the constitution suspended.

Good for you! 26.Aug.2002 17:43

Sadyra

I commend you for bringing your children along to the protest. Regardless of age it is important to teach your young ones what it means to live in a democracy and that it is VERY crucial to exercise their rights. It will only serve to make them strong, educated and outspoken individuals later on in life. For those of you who feel it necessary to complain about Donalds parenting skills, I think that perhaps you should worry about your own inadequacies before you tell someone how to teach their children about the world around them. It is not your decision to make. It is rather unfortunate that their children got pepper sprayed, but it does not change the fact that they did have the right to be there. The police were out of hand. I saw it with my own eyes. I saw the aftermath of what had happened to these children and it broke my heart. But I will not now, or ever, say that children have no place at any political action. If anything, the police have no right to be there. They obviously do not support what the rallies are about, and only serve to intensify the danger of attending. If they really didn't want to be there and didn't morally agree with their orders, why go along with them? Simply becoming part of law enforcement does not make you into a robot. It is possble to maintain some sense of rational thought and do your job. Pepper spraying a child in the face for any reason is NOT a rational thought. Any officer guilty of doing this does not deserve to be walking aroung a free individual. Remember.....police are meant to protect and serve, not harrass and violently attack.

Chemical Weapons Against Children 26.Aug.2002 18:06

brew brew@thedailybrew.com

I am sickened that the Portland police assaulted you and your children with chemical weapons. I hope you and your kids are OK. I hope you have the courage and stamina to tell the world about the crimes committed against you. People need to know that the Bush Administration is willing to use these brutal tactics to thwart the Constitutional rights of ordinary citizens to attend a fundraiser no less.


Mail and email addresses for media desired 26.Aug.2002 18:24

Mark

Rather than so much commenting, what would be really helpful is for someone from Portland to post the phone numbers, mail and email addresses of the major local newspapers and TV stations' news desks.

This would allow everyone who has commented here to take their same comments and write or call or fax these media outlets and ask what is happening with this story. If enough people ask (and it does not take that many), it will get mentioned. It's an interesting enough story that it might get picked up by some national outlet, which will be truly worthwhile.

Give us out-of-towners this kind of information so we can help. And if you're local, question the local media outlets. Ask them whether they've heard about this particularly story, and if so, why they think it is an unimportant part of the coverage about Bush's visit.

Children have a right to participate, too 26.Aug.2002 18:40

A Patriotic American jacksonthor@yahoo.com

To all those blaming the victims and telling people not to bring their children to protests, I say it's important to allow our children to participate in democracy, not just read about it in textbooks. Democracy might get messy at times, but it's our responsibility to show our kids that you have a voice and to stand up for what you think is right.
Look at the Boston Tea Party of 1770. That was a violent protest in which property was vandalized for a reason, and we glorify the participants, as we should. If our forefathers can damage property, we can still damage property when it works to show a point, like point out how the tax on tea was wrong. We should damage property but not individuals.

We need to come up with some targeted action like the Boston Tea Party and have waves of it across the country. Perhaps we should go to gas stations, especially Exxon-Mobil ones, and dump gas to protest Bush's war in the middle east for oil.

Last year, I brought my 1-year-old son to a protest against Bush in Wash. D.C. Fortunately, there was no violence by the police or anyone else there. It's important for protesters to bring their children to show the media, police, government, and everyone else that we are middle America, we have families, and we aren't going to stand for what the illegitimate leaders in the White House are doing to our country and the planet. We are just some black-clad radical leftovers from the '60s. We are Patriots who want our country back.
Such events as in Portland will give me pause on whether to bring my son again to a protest. But I think he has a right to be there. This is America, supposedly we still have certain rights.
The ones who are to blame for the violence are the ones who did it, which in this case, as usual, were the police and the Bush forces who put them up to it. The parents who brought their children to the protests are not to blame. They are patriotic Americans who wanted to show their kids democracy in action. And they got Bush fascism in action. But that's America, as it now is. Let's keep hitting the streets and bring about another revolution, as non-violently as we can [towards humans, not property].

Jackson Thoreau


Protest is American! 26.Aug.2002 19:21

drone drone@rccis.com

Some of the responses on this forum; the 911 operator's refusal to help--it all adds up to an attitude that the protestors aren't fellow human beings deserving of being treated with decency, kindness and respect. I don't know where this attitude comes from. As "A Patriotic American" thankfully points out above, this nation was founded on dissent. It's right there in the Constitution, in the First Amendment--we, the people, have the right to "petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The police always go in bearing sadistic "non-lethal" weapons and a combative attitude--is it any wonder why the result is always the same? This underscores why we need citizen review (with teeth) of the Portland Police Bureau.

By the way, rubber bullets aren't intended to be targeted at individuals. They're supposed to be fired from a distance, and richocheted into people's legs as a technique to get them to leave an area. Personally, I'd like to see pepper spray and rubber bullets banned, but if we must have them, at least the police could learn to use them properly.

this is for LibRscum 26.Aug.2002 19:45

SouthCity

You are obviously a cop or a lawyer. Personally I dont know which is worse, but I can tell you what I do know about you without ever having met. You are a weak minded foolish person with a college degree (educated idiot) with very few friends, if any at all, and more than likely 1 or more failed marriages. One more thing I can tell you is that yourself and people like you will Lick boots right up to the time when someone like me puts my boot so far up your ass you will taste it. My disdain for you and others with your type of mentality is huge, and believe it or not, people like me are the majority and ready to come out into the daylight. Believe it and sleep well punk, but you will get it in the end and doesn't look pretty....

Why? 26.Aug.2002 19:47

Andre

Why DID you brng those kids to a protest. Have you lost your mind? You have no sympathy from me, my friend. Yes, the police were out of line, and that is another issue. You put your kids in harms way and that's why I have a problem with this.

cdavidi2002 26.Aug.2002 20:02

State Candidate for House of Mo.

It doesn't matter whether there were kids there or not, and if the comment was made by an official that parents shouldn't bring their kids to a rally (protest or whatever), then that officer should be found and prosecuted. We are supposed to live in the land of the FREE, but we have overzealous gov't personnel pushing their weight around when it is absolutely not needed. When I win my election I will be the one in the faces of officers defending MY Constituents rights at all costs. That's what they elect me for.

This is definitely a U.N. Agenda in using a storm trooper attitude and ALL officers should be prosecuted to get the real culprits of endangering our children. They (the children) are our most precious commodity! They did not deserve to be treated as they were. These children will remember this for the rest of their lives whether we like it or not. Peace officers are just that (peace officers) and the ethics commission should step right in with a full investigation. In my opinion, make an example of the guilty officers.

As far as I'm concerned, they (the police) acted under orders and advice from a foreign power. Totally Unconstitutional. These officers acted as treasonists and should be treated as such! Prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and under tribunal law. Gov't personnel technically give up their constituional rights once they don the hat or the uniform as being on duty (public servants). The citizen has even more power to give orders than they do as long as they remain within the law. Demonstrations are legal under constituional law, and I don't think anyone violated that right since nobody was arrested for not having a permit to peacefully demonstrate.


Hey LIBSrSCUM 26.Aug.2002 20:39

Liberial

Just another sheep along for the ride. Get a life!

Who is Insane? You're just A sheople 26.Aug.2002 20:50

cdavidi

Sounds like the sheople (those who follow the shepherd or the leader) have spoken. This is exactly what the elitists who run this country want you to believe. That all protesters, PATRIOTS, and anyone who dislikes what is happening in our government are terrorists and immediately implement USA PATRIOT ACT.

Police DO have the responsibilty to safety first whether children are there or not. The officer should have assessed the request after seeing the child (and HE DID)and reacted appropriately not indiscriminately as HE DID! The officer was totally in the wrong and all officers should be held accountable for the wrong of one officer. These officers hold all accountable in a protest even if only one or two cause the unrest. Turnabout is fair play in this matter, as the "Code of Silence" between officers will be implemented when the charges are leveled!

A Fascist State Are We 26.Aug.2002 21:35

Outraged American

My feelings towards some of these so-called policemen
are such that I had better not express them here in a public forum as I am afraid that a visit from the FBI might ensue. I think all reading this can read between the lines here.
People have the right to defend themselves, and it is a god-given right, not given by the government and therefore
not legally abrogated by it. If they were my children being pepper-sprayed, all I can say is god protect the slime who did it.

<