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US President created Pearl Harbor

The evidence is clear and it is now accepted historical fact that the FDR and the Pentagon not only knew that the Japanese were going to attack Pearl harbor, but that they maneuvered the Japanese into doing so, in order to anger the U.S. citizens into supporting the U.S. to join the war.

The U.S. cut off the supply of oil to Japan, which forced them to take some action against the US.

There are many records of communications by both the US Navy and Japanese Navy which make it clear the US knew the attack was coming, and purposefully did not tell the military leaders in Hawaii. Churchill wrote in his Nobel Prize winning series on WWII that FDR knew about the Japanese plans to attack Pearl Harbor.

That is 2400 American deaths, purposefully allowed by the president of this country.

In addition, 8 ships were sunk, and 188 planes destroyed, with a further 162 planes damaged

This one case, which is of the same scope as the Sept 11th attacks on the World trade Center, shows that the US government is capable of conceiving, implementing, and carrying out the attacks on the World Trade Center, massive attacks on its own citizens.

[ Churchill on FDR | Background Info ]

Wait a minute! 26.Dec.2001 14:00

Mike stepbystepfarm@shaysnet.com

To understand "Pearl Harbor" try reading "Sea Power" by Pratt which was published shortly BEFORE the start of WWII (and thus a few years before Pearl Harbor.

You are confusing knowing WHERE the Japanese would strike (if they decided upon war) with being able to prevent that attack. That would require knowing "exactly when" and "by what route". The ships left in Pearl as "bait" precisely follow Pratt's recommendations. In the actual event, these suffered more than expected damage (Japanese torpedos ere FAR superior) and the US was lucky our carrier fleet was NOT cruising close enough to support the defense (because in Dec 1941 the Zero was far superior to the US carrier fighters -- we had better planes being built but these were not yet deployed).

Try looking at the alternatives for 9/11/01 Are you postitive that intercepting and shooting down the hijacked airliners would have been a better solution? Better for whom?

US knew 26.Dec.2001 15:13

drumbeat

your points about Pearl Harbor ignore the main point. The President knew, and did not inform Pearl Harbor. In fact, false information of the whereabouts of the Japanese fleet were purposefully given. And yes, Washington knew where the fleet was, and when it was going to attack.

As for the WTC attacks, there is no excuse for not scrambling jets. You cannot hide behind the same illogical and bogus excuse given by cheney.

If the US did not know what was coming, then scrambling jets makes complete sense. Knowing nothing, one would most likely assume it was a regular hijacking. Knowing nothing, you put up jets to look and to find out what is going on - and at that point there would be no idea that it was necessary to shoot anything down

Your argument, presupposes prior knowledge

The only circumstance under which you can argue that it was pointless to scramble jets, is if you knew beforehand what was going to happen!

It is the most likely conclusion that the US government knew what was coming. Couple that with plans to attack Afghanistan in October, and a Patriot Act waiting in the wings, and the US not only knew, but was counting on it!

Nice Spin, Mike 26.Dec.2002 20:53

Hirohito

With this submarine discovery below, I think it is safe to say that the U.S. military had about an hour's notice of the Pearl Harbor attacks.

The author of this thread said nothing about intercepting and shooting down airliners (which is what the current rulers have openly offered to do the next time, btw).

You appear to be creating a straw-man here. A better "alternative" might be for the U.S. to stop funding, training, and participating in global terrorism. Another might be to throw the illegitamate rulers of the Divided States in prison, before they facilitate, or, at best, demonstrate their collective gross criminal negligence, and cost the lives of thousands more. And yes, intercepting hijacked planes, (not to include shooting them down), is a helluva lot better than watching the radar blip disappear into a crash site. Yes, 911 certainly was a lot like Pearl Harbor; 'rally the savages', and all that.

From:

 http://www.navalships.org/shipwrecks2.html

H O N O L U L U, Aug. 29 - 2002 Nearly 61 years after the attack on Pearl Harbor, researchers say they have found evidence that the U.S. military fired the first shot against Japan with the discovery of a sunken Japanese submarine.

The military says it inflicted the first casualties when the USS Ward sank the approaching Japanese sub at 6:45 a.m. on Dec. 7, 1941, about an hour before the aerial attack.

In Your Face
Nice Spin, Mike
Nice Spin, Mike